Just a random thought.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20356281)

Japan sort of got its shit together.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357140)

Chinese children now actually learn the ALPHABET first (pinyin) to help them learn their fucked up picture language.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20356309)

SLANTEYES - being fluent in both english and your hometown primitive language, is it as easy to be as expressive in your home tongue?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20356539)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_miracle

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357336)

in china, an emperor could simply order a halt to exploration, and it would be halted.

in europe, a king who did that would probably get a sword through the back the next night in his castle, and everyone would ignore him anyway.

that's a cultural difference worth exploring, to say the least.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357104)

It's Confucianism + a lack of any value for reason, esp the post-enlightenment concept of it.

The Chinese see a leader as someone who decides. One viewpoint is always better than many, even if many are seen as fine. The leader is not necessarily someone who must be right through anything resembling reason in the Western sense. It's one of the reasons Maoism is so batshit insane (it fuses Marxism with COnfucianism with Psychoticism).

Their culture is different. Really different.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357134)

CHINESE PEOPLE: Yes, Emperor!

*fleet is burned*

EUROPEAN KING: Burn the fleet!

KING'S SUBJECTS: Fuck off you fucking cunt!

*smashes in king's skull with a mace*

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357150)

Hell the Han even had a fucking tales of chivalry/knight errant genre a la Chretien (or maybe Amadis is more appropriate?) called Youxia

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357210)

It's dramatized in Romance of the 3 Kingdoms, if memory serves.

Han is the nearest analogue to the middle ages.

We're all neglecting the fact that Chinese culture is very old.

I would recommend reading ROT3K or playing Dynasty Warriors 3-6 (it's actually pretty faithful) for further background on this phenomena.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357271)

Nations didn't even exist in much of Europe and when they did, feudalism complicates things e.g. Henry II was a feudal vassal of France.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357197)

Where would you start? The assimilation/deposition of the French ruling class? THe hundred years war?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357263)

The 17th century. The Peace of Westphalia, 1648.

It's really a progress during the 17th century, but the Westphalia Peace gave sovereigns the first kind of state-like authority.

Certainly not at any time before the 1600s, though.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357274)

I'd still say British national identity (in England at least) was cemented much earlier, if not formalized.

Kissinger fan?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357275)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#20357258)

Date: February 26th, 2025 9:28 PM

Author: hank_scorpio

azn's still haven't really discovered writing, they are just using a bunch of hieroglyphs

http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5536032&forum_id=2#48697467

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#48697484)

LOLLERCAUSTERING

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#48697489)

why not three dimensional ambigramic characters like a real civilization

barbaric

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#48712186)

everyone wants to migrate to what was formerly called Christendom, and to the extent that region is falling it's because the region has fallen away from the Gospel.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#50081866)

The alphabet theory has real teeth but nobody's calibrating it right.

The OP is pointing at something genuine: Chinese movable type was technically inferior to block printing for logographic writing. A Chinese page needs 5,000+ distinct type pieces; a German page needs ~200. The assembly cost per page made movable type functionally useless for Chinese, even though they invented it centuries before Gutenberg. That's documented — Dieter Stein has the research. The printing press catalyzed Europe's information explosion partly because Europe's writing system made the technology actually work.

But it's necessary, not sufficient. Korea designed Hangul — arguably the best alphabetic writing system ever — in 1443, had printing technology, and still didn't industrialize. Vietnam adopted the Roman alphabet in the 1600s and didn't either. The alphabet → printing → diffusion chain needs other links: institutions that can't just shut down exploration because an emperor has a bad mood, property rights, a merchant class with disposable capital.

The coal argument above is probably the stronger single cause. Energy density is the hard bottleneck. But even that doesn't explain Britain vs. France, both of which had coal. So you need the institutional layer (Acemoglu/Robinson): Europe's fragmentation meant no single authority could suppress innovation everywhere. Once information escaped one jurisdiction, it was free. The alphabet just made it cheap to copy.

Bottom line: the alphabet made the printing press work for Europe and not for China. But the printing press alone doesn't explain why Europe used what it printed.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1912841&forum_id=2)#50088033)