The most prestigious law school admissions discussion board in the world.
|
 |
 
|
How to talk about Israel in the context of international law without outing self
Poast new message in this thread
Date: October 9th, 2024 6:51 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Here's the problem: you only hear these arguments coming from a small handful of people in the English-speaking legal academy. That means any non-Hebrew speaker who knows these arguments has been in the company of only a handful of people worldwide. That can cause a lot of confusion about who you are and what your agenda is and what grade you got in that class. It can make one feel marked for death not flame. The prof's name is on my damn transcript and so is the grade. And he was visiting, I didn't actually go to his school, jesus. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182019) |
Date: October 9th, 2024 6:58 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Ok here's something I can say without outing self, because it's something no Israeli law prof would ever say:
There's no goddamn reason on earth Jordan can't just include all of present-day "Israel" and "Palestine" without violating any principle of international law, period. Jews can be forcibly subjugated by this king, who will of course give them full legal protection since Jordan is already a client state of the US. "Jordan" can be a conduit for whatever the fuck we want to do over there, or we can just turn the keys over to "Jordan" and let them run it. It's a stable monarchy over there. The ruling family isn't going anywhere. No one is gonna fuck with Jordan.
This could be done without creating any of the "first mover" problems that arise when you talk about tampering with any other borders in the region, or when talking about creating a new state for Palestinians, Kurds, or any other group. It puts the whole issue to bed.
Furthermore, if anyone in the UK had put any forethought into this, or had any idea what the future would bring for the UK, they would have done exactly this. The only reason it wasn't done was because the UK lost the opportunity to do jack shit. People imagine the UK drawing these borders but it only did that by accident. Things just got frozen in place at a certain point in time when the map looked like that, it wasn't meant to be like that forever. |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:04 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Fact: any property rights any Israeli settlers claim in disputed territory are private property rights, the same as any other private property rights the Israeli government might be obliged to respect. Can UN tell you not to buy land in a certain part of Virginia? Can the UN tell you it's "illegal" for the US government to let you to build a farm on a patch of land in Virginia? That would be weird.
That argument is out the window now, because Israel is showing no respect for the property rights of Palestinians at all. The government is not even pretending to offer a social contract to these people. Lawyers for the settlers are now useless. There's no reason to send anyone to the UN to make these kinds of arguments anymore. Is it any wonder the settlers are leaving and never coming back? |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:07 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Kurdistan: why doesn't it exist? Aren't Kurds just as deserving of a state as anyone in the middle east? Open ended question. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182051) |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:10 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr How can anyone justify that piece of Jordan that touches Iraq's sphincter? Does Jordan want it? Do Iraqis ever worry that it might be abused? What if it's just empty desert, and Jordan doesn't want it, and decides to give it to Iraq as a gesture of goodwill? Would Iraq accept it? Why not? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182063) |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:15 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Rate my final exam answer:
https://i.imgur.com/6uvDdS2.png |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:22 PM Author: '"'"'"''" "law" is flame for low-T dorks. Real men take what they want. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182102) |
 |
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:29 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Not in the Middle East. Borders are sacrosanct there in ways that are perhaps unique. There's a weird tacit agreement all heads of state seem to share about this.
One could argue that "Israel" exists because Jews were able to exploit this inertia. No one else was willing to claim that land. |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:28 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr What caused the borders of the middle east to have their current form?
The borders of the Middle East have undergone significant changes throughout history, driven by various factors such as:
1. **Ancient Empires**: The Middle East was once part of several ancient empires, including the Sumerian, Babylonian, Assyrian, Persian, and Roman empires. These empires established territorial boundaries that have been modified over time. 2. **Islamic Conquests (7th-13th centuries)**: With the rise of Islam, the Arab conquests spread throughout the Middle East, leading to the establishment of Islamic states and caliphates. The borders of these states were often defined by geographical features, trade routes, and strategic locations. 3. **Ottoman Empire (13th-20th centuries)**: The Ottoman Empire played a significant role in shaping the modern borders of the Middle East. The empire expanded into the region through conquests and established a system of provinces (vilayets) that became the foundation for many modern-day countries. 4. **British and French Colonization (19th-20th centuries)**: During the Scramble for Africa and the Middle East, European powers such as Britain, France, and Russia carved out territories in the region through a series of treaties, agreements, and colonial expeditions. The Sykes-Picot Agreement (1916) and the Mandate System (1920-1947) are notable examples. 5. **Post-WWII Redrawing**: After World War II, the international community redrew the borders of the Middle East to reflect emerging nation-states and the creation of Israel in 1948. The United Nations played a significant role in this process.
**Key events that shaped modern Middle Eastern borders:**
1. **Treaty of Sèvres (1920)**: This treaty, signed after World War I, established the boundaries of Turkey's Arab territories and created modern-day Iraq. 2. **Sykes-Picot Agreement (1916)**: A secret agreement between Britain and France that divided the Middle East into spheres of influence, leading to the creation of Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Iraq, and Turkey. 3. **Balfour Declaration (1917)**: This British statement expressed support for the establishment of a Jewish homeland in Palestine, which ultimately led to the creation of Israel in 1948. 4. **Arab-Israeli Conflict (1948-present)**: The ongoing conflict between Israelis and Palestinians has resulted in multiple border adjustments, including the displacement of Palestinians and the annexation of territories by Israel. 5. **Kurdish and Armenian Genocides**: The Ottoman Empire's brutal suppression of Kurdish and Armenian populations led to significant territorial losses for these groups, resulting in modern-day disputes over borders and recognition.
**Current challenges:**
1. **Palestinian refugee crisis**: The displacement of Palestinians during the 1948 war and subsequent conflicts continues to be a pressing issue. 2. **Kurdish separatism**: The Kurdish people's desire for independence or autonomy remains unfulfilled, leading to tensions with neighboring countries and ongoing conflict in Turkey, Iraq, Syria, and Iran. 3. **Israeli-Palestinian conflict**: The Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip continues to be a major source of tension and conflict in the region.
The borders of the Middle East continue to evolve due to ongoing conflicts, disputes over territory, and shifting regional dynamics. |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:33 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Palestine problem: how to create a new state in the middle east and justify yourself to arabs who have been told their entire lives by their governments that "it's impossible to create new states in the middle east don't even think about it." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182138) |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:36 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Possible solution #1: let Jews create it and blame it on them. Let Jews continue to act weird in the part they didn't demarcate as "Palestine." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182153) |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:38 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Possible solution #2: let Palestine remain a de facto state without a border for 20 years without collapsing politically, and just wait for the effects of that to sink in, or until October 7, whichever comes first. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182166) |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 7:42 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr Pop quiz: why doesn't "Jordan" just include that damn river? Who gives a fuck about a river? The UK never gave a fuck about that river, did it? If you were the British governor of Jordan why would you turn down a free river? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5609312&forum_id=2],#48182186) |
|
Date: October 9th, 2024 8:48 PM Author: https://imgur.com/a/IkQnGlr In what respect was it accurate to call the British Mandate a "mandate?"
Upon re-examination, I must clarify that the term "Mandate" in this context is somewhat misleading.
The British Mandate for Palestine was not a true "mandate" in the sense that it was a sovereign authority granted by the League of Nations to a colonial power (Britain) to administer a territory on behalf of an indigenous population.
Instead, the British were simply administering the territory as a League of Nations mandate under Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations. This provision allowed for the administration of territories "which have been occupied or administered by [the Allied Powers] in respect of and to the satisfaction of the populations concerned" until such time as they could be self-governing.
In practice, the British held significant control over Palestine's foreign affairs, defense, and some domestic matters, while leaving the territory's internal administration largely in the hands of the Palestinian population. However, the term "Mandate" is often used to suggest a level of autonomy or self-governance that did not exist.
A more accurate description might be that the British were administering Palestine as an "Occupying Power" under League of Nations mandate provisions, with significant control over key aspects of governance and limited Palestinian participation in decision-making processes.
Thanks for pointing out this nuance! |