Capitalism Inevitably Leads to Greater Concentration of Wealth
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:03 PM Author: Histrionic Sticky Son Of Senegal
How do you propose to incentivize work & labor, then?
Are you going to appeal to moral duty? (LOL YEAH RIGHT!)
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21223960) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:18 PM Author: Histrionic Sticky Son Of Senegal
I'm just saying that what really motivates most people is greed, lust, and the desire to be or at least be seen as being superior by other people. Capitalism is successful because it harnesses or exploits this in such a way that the rest of society benefits. It is, in essence, the "private vices, public benefits" theory of economics. And it seems to work, whereas appealing to duty or virtue does not.
Yeah, unequal wealth distribution does tend to result from this, but I guess them's the breaks. Unless you can find some other way of motivating a fallen mankind, I just don't see any alternative to capitalism.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224082) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:59 PM Author: Histrionic Sticky Son Of Senegal
Very quickly
1) you have a system in which the proles are completely dependent upon the capitalists for their livelihoods, yet the capitalists only create jobs incidentally. Their primary motivation is profit, and if they can generate profit by cutting jobs or sending them overseas, they will do that.
2) Because they are only interested in profit, they don't care much about waste or the environment. Worse yet, because the capitalists are in competition with one another, they can't really afford to do anything which might hamper their ability to compete, e.g., reduce efficiency to protect environment. So it would fall to the government to do something, yet in practice they are pro-business and don't want to do anything which might cut even more jobs.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224351) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 3:03 PM Author: Odious federal haunted graveyard nibblets
man, it's been a few years since i was on my econ kick but i distinctly remember veblen and max weber. then i went through a austrian economics phase. then came back around after reading galbraith.
what really got me was galbraith's point about how efficient production is not really a primary goal of society in light of the fact that we now have to manufacture demand. this calls into question so many fundamental principles of capitalism.
i also remember reading something about how ricardo, malthus, marx and some other guy all convincingly argued how capitalism was inevitably destined to fail. i'm not scholarly enough to recount each of their arguments.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224379) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:27 PM Author: copper mind-boggling newt
It is wrong because:
1) Humans are inherently different, this means there will ALWAYS be stratification. It is funny however that the system Marx advocates, socialism, exacerbates this stratification by placing the bureaucrats far above anyone else.
2) Marx claims that the worker can only express labour in the market. This again is totally false. Every entrepreneur who started with $50 in the bank is a counter example.
It is also irrelevant.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224140) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:20 PM Author: copper mind-boggling newt
"The problem with markets is that it inevitably will be littered with distortions. I can elaborate on this further."
Give me a distortion that:
a) Is not a result of gov't intereference
b) Can be shown to be handled by your socialist model more effectively
"Second, markets do not take into consideration the environmental degradation that will arise from purportedly rational economic decisions entirely predicated on profit maximization.,"
Wrong. Markets do not take into consideration environmental degradation when the GOVERNMENT does not allow legal action on the part of people being polluted. Up until the 1840s if the nearby coal factory was producing pollution that was damaging yourself and your property you could go to the courts and get an injunction on the plant. The gov't however decided that it was in the interest of the "greater good" to not let measly personal property get in the way of industrial development and began to quash these complaints. Pollution is ultimately an invasion of property, if you apply property rights consistently you do have those polluting paying the price for their actions. It is no coincidence that in those times and places where property rights are least defended, namely the USSR as an example, the amount of environmental damage was MUCH higher.
You are dumb and never learn, but for those others reading, if you want to see a good summary:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMxgYY_q-AI
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224103) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:26 PM Author: Ruddy filthpig
Consumers need viable options from which they can choose and make trade-offs, based on a whole set of factors, like price, where they happen to be, and so on. Agreed? Yes.
Prices should reflect the marginal cost of the products/services being tendered. Agreed? Well, here is the market distortion. Often times, due to dumping, intellectual property thefts, and other forms of economic distortions waged by capitalist economies (read Wallerstein's theory for more), prices fail to reflect adequate marginal cost, and in fact, the profits elicited become a mechanism for the rich, core countries to dominate the periphery countries that do not have stable democratic institutions.
Third, Public policies (investments, taxes, subsidies,
and regulations) should not favor one good or group over others--yet capitalist economies provide the greatest help to the rich and elitist sectors of society to distort real economic performance.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224135) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:30 PM Author: copper mind-boggling newt
"Prices should reflect the marginal cost of the products/services being tendered. Agreed? "
WHAT THE FUCK? So if I spend $100 worth of labour digging mud out of my backyard, putting it in a dump truck and dumping it on your front lawn, that is "worth" $100? Get your fucking illegitimate LTV out of this thread you idiot. Value (i.e what leads to prices) are SUBJECTIVE and having NOTHING to do with the cost of production.
"Third, Public policies (investments, taxes, subsidies, and regulations) should not favor one good or group over others--yet capitalist economies provide the greatest help to the rich and elitist sectors of society to distort real economic performance. "
The only thing I agree with you, but if the gov't has already show itself to be easily hijacked by the elite when it is given power to regulate and invest and control the economy, how is giving it MORE control as you have in a socialist state going to change anything except make it worse?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224161) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 2:41 PM Author: copper mind-boggling newt
And yet another convo between us ends following the typical receipt:
1) SSM creates thread making retarded claims
2) I destroy any feeble arguments SSM puts forward
3) SSM reverts back to either his original conclusion with no substantiation, a copy and paste job or something non-sensical.
You are now appealing to this notion of "happiness" which is both logically and empirically impossible to assess as though it supports your stance.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224223) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 3:11 PM Author: naked dashing wagecucks
Dude, NOT DYING. Look, communism is fucking absurd on multiple obvious levels.
The fact that you can even pose this ridiculous line of questioning, free from being carted off to a gulag already makes you truly wealthy compared to your existence under a communist regime.
My father was at a bar. His friend made a joke about Stalin. They were both immediately arrested. My father was questioned for a full day before eventually being released. His crime was laughing.
The other guy was never seen again.
And this was one of the most "liberal" of the iron curtain countries.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224442) |
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Date: July 31st, 2012 3:05 PM Author: naked dashing wagecucks
Comrade,
Bread lines =/= condition for fostering happiness
Surprising I know, but there you have it.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2010352&forum_id=2#21224402)
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