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"An empty gap is preferable to applebee's."
Poast new message in this thread
Date: March 9th, 2010 10:02 PM Author: Demanding den potus Is this for real?
When I was in undergrad they always gave the opposite advice, and I give the opposite to friends starting the job hunt. The thinking was that a few years waiting tables>>a two summer gap on some kids resume.
Have I been giving bad info to these folks? |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:03 PM Author: aquamarine boyish stage there is a dividing line that separates proles from the elite, those who consider themselves to be elite would prefer the gap, proles and non-tools would generally prefer some kind of work, regardless of the kind, to nothing (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346195) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:05 PM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house yes. this is what i was thinking. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346214) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 2:24 PM Author: stirring space personal credit line titcr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14351693) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:04 PM Author: passionate locus Yes. Much better not to work and bullshit about spending the time learning a language or writing or something. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346200) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:07 PM Author: Demanding den potus Often I wish employers could smell bullshit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346235) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:32 PM Author: Garnet Geriatric Generalized Bond Internal Respiration your poast is horribly worded. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347234) |
Date: March 9th, 2010 10:03 PM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house don't listen to me. i'm an idiot. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346188) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:03 PM Author: splenetic center blood rage titcr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346194) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:04 PM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house but really it depends on the type of job you're applying to. listing applebees for certain positions could put you at a disadvantage, and you're probably better off just leaving an empty gap. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346199) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:35 PM Author: fragrant chapel haunted graveyard "but really it depends on the type of job you're applying to."
No it doesn't; you're always an idiot. |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:06 PM Author: Demanding den potus I'm not calling you out about this, it just got me thinking on the issue. I don't want to ruin some 20 y/o's shot at a trading desk cause they put "Pizza Delivery Driver 2007-2009" on an otherwise desirable resume. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346223) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:06 PM Author: aquamarine boyish stage you can leave that shit off (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346227) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:08 PM Author: Demanding den potus Most middle class kids will have an empty resume then. Many of my friends simply were not able to do anything but work a menial job over the summer due to family demands.
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:07 PM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house in this case, he's better off leaving a gap on his resume. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346239) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:52 PM Author: Big magenta rigor Bullshit. I review resumes for ibanking summer analysts right now and neither the blank resume nor the applebees gets in, but if we were lowering the bar to people without finance experience I would absolutely take the kid that worked over some douche bag who has never worked a real job. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347451) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:01 AM Author: marvelous french stag film cuckoldry CR. one of my friends said her interview liked how she had cashiering experience while others in her industry had just done bullshit ECs during the school year. lulz (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347542) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:08 AM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house that's irrelevant if you don't mention where she interviewed. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347607) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:18 AM Author: Demanding den potus I received comments similar to this from a middle market IB, a blue state politicians field team, and a federal reserve bank.
Edit: or are these prole employers that should themselves be left off of a prestigious resume? |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 10:12 AM Author: impertinent spectacular theater stage fat ankles The answer is it depends on who is interviewing you. If your interviewer is a banker from a blue-collar background (and you can sort of smell this out during the interview if he gives away his background or by the questions he asks) he'll be ok applebee's. When I interviewed with banks in college, there were clearly interviewers who cared where I came from (asked if I was on financial aid, if I went to public hs, etc), and there were others who thought the opposite. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14349690) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:08 PM Author: honey-headed meetinghouse who the fuck thinks like this? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346246) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:51 PM Author: trip milk Uh, people looking for prestigious jobs? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347442) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:52 PM Author: honey-headed meetinghouse why would any job consider not working better than working? Especially if the applicant was young during the time frame? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347454) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:55 PM Author: trip milk Because for a lot of jobs its about "fit". What that means is that interviewers have plenty of resumes from people with top grades so they want people they like. Whether fair or not, this might work against someone who worked mostly as a pizza delivery driver rather than take a more "prestigious" unpaid internship somewhere, made possible by the fact that they come from a rich, well connected family. A blank gives someone plausible deniability (I was learning X language), whereas "pizza delivery driver" doesn't.
Basically, while I'm sure you would hate working at places like this, most of us are gunning to do exactly that. |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:58 PM Author: honey-headed meetinghouse This sounds stupid as fuck. Obviously, I can understand internship > pizza delivery but I can in no way understand blank > pizza delivery.
What a bunch of morons. No wonder your profession is tanking. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:25 AM Author: trip milk Because they would probably replace it with other bullshit, like another learned language. Basically, the Applebees experience is fucking irrelevant to the job application. The additional language may or may not be irrelevant, but is probably more relevant than some prole job.
I don't really think it is that unusual that people want to hire people a lot like themselves. If they're snobbish then that means they'll prefer snobbish people as well. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:06 AM Author: Embarrassed To The Bone Cruise Ship If you don't have other internships, I'd say list the crappy job rather than not. It's not like an additional language is going to be cut for space on the kind of resume where Applebees is a consideration as a job listing. No one has anything in common with a blank spot. You will meet people who worked their way through school. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348188) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:56 AM Author: Spruce tantric tank It is stupid, i agree with you. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348105) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:59 PM Author: Big magenta rigor This is so wrong. I review resumes for ibd sa's.
Obviously I will take an unpaid internship for a senator or something over applebees, but if one kid was fucking around "traveling" and one kid actually worked and gave at least a tiny idication he had some work ethic, I take the kid that worked over the blank resume every time. Of course ITE, all 3 get dinged without interview, but the point still stands. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:03 AM Author: honey-headed meetinghouse That's good to hear. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347554) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:05 AM Author: diverse poppy clown this comparison only exists in fantasyland. job candidates either have relevant experience and education or they don't. irrelevant experience is just that - irrelevant. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347578) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:25 AM Author: trip milk Basically. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347795) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:23 AM Author: trip milk Right, but some people see it differently. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347767) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:39 AM Author: cowardly shaky church ITE is such a fucking joke.
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:03 AM Author: Carnelian Sanctuary I'd take the kid who traveled over the kid who worked at Applebee's if the choice came down to that and their resumes were otherwise equal. Fit plays a large part in hiring decisions. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348156) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:05 AM Author: violent chocolate national which is better determined in an interview (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348178) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:09 AM Author: Carnelian Sanctuary If I had to choose, I'd bring the travel kid over the Applebee's kid in for the interview. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348205) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:11 AM Author: Embarrassed To The Bone Cruise Ship I'd take the Applebees kid.
If the applicant didn't say what they were doing at all, would either of us take him or her (or be willing to grant an interview to learn more) based just on the resume? I think that's the real question. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:13 AM Author: Carnelian Sanctuary If the travel applicant detailed his travel experiences, I would take the travel kid. If the travel kid didn't state anything, I would take the Applebee's kid on the logic that doing something, no matter how menial, is better than smoking weed and playing Xbox. This is assuming that both are applying for their first job out of college.
If this was a situation where both kids had lots of other relevant jobs/internships on their resume and the travel kid had a gap with no description of travel and the Applebee's kid had Applebee's, I'd take the travel kid. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:19 AM Author: Embarrassed To The Bone Cruise Ship That's fair. I would take the Applebees kid over the travel kid with detailed listing, but we are two different people with two different sets of preferences about personalities. But that's not really a resume question. Either you used the time to travel, or to work at Applebees, or to smoke weed. I think we're both in agreement that the Applebees kid is better telling people what he was doing than risk being confused with the pot smoker.
If we're talking about people with lots of experience who can't possibly list every position they've had, I'd rather hear about the job from 5 years ago that somewhat related to the applied for one than the Applebees job to pay the bills. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:27 AM Author: Carnelian Sanctuary Sounds about right. Basically the advice for people in this predicament is to list whatever gainful or interesting thing you did (be it travel or menial labor or whatever) to prevent the inference that you were smoking pot and masturbating for the duration of your unemployment. Agreed 100% on your last paragraph.
Although if I'm interviewing people for a particularly unprestigious, mind-numbing job that requires a lot of grunt work (the kind of job that would be ill-suited for anyone with an entitled attitude) I might pick the Applebee's person over the travel person even if the travel guy listed "travel" on his resume. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:11 AM Author: violent chocolate national I wouldn't. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348214) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:14 AM Author: trip milk An interview is 20-30 minutes long and what's on the resume is the basis for conversation. So someone who relates to someone who travels instead of works at Applebees will decide that the former will be a better "fit." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348245) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:17 AM Author: violent chocolate national It is easy to shift the interview. I don't think we'll be talking about the appetizers at applebees. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348277) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:18 AM Author: trip milk The point is that if conversation flows more naturally to a direction that interests the interviewer then that'll work to the interviewee's advantage. Again, depends on what the interviewer is like. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348292) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:21 AM Author: Embarrassed To The Bone Cruise Ship Agreed. And that's a judgment based on what you think your interviewer will judge more harshly.
But I think either person is in trouble if it's assumed they hung out in mom's basement during college summers because they didn't say what they did (since we're talking about people who don't have lots of relevant professional experience). |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:39 AM Author: trip milk Agreed. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348474) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:03 AM Author: violent chocolate national some people are like this. some are not. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347558) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:22 AM Author: trip milk No doubt. But my point is that quite a few people are like this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347762) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:09 PM Author: Odious clear crackhouse no one gives a shit what you do during your college summers unless it is an internship focused towards your after college job.
work if you need the money, otherwise no one cares. That said it is useful to get some sort of career focused job the summer before senior year, but the first three summers, drink and do drugs. |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 10:12 PM Author: Demanding den potus I'd say 2/3's of internships I applied for required at least one previous internship, regardless of its relevance. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14346291) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:38 PM Author: salmon gaping true, and striving's better than drinking and doing drugs anyway (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347297) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:05 AM Author: Heady amethyst theatre not really (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348171) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:39 PM Author: Razzmatazz navy police squad this is because no one wants to be the one to train a first-time intern who has never worked in an office before. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347308) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:44 PM Author: flatulent plaza idea he suggested On my resume, I usually list things that don't sound quite as prolish and then have one section that says Other work experience: Delivery boy, barista, manicurist, bla bla bla
Just so people know I'm capable of working hard and not dicking around. A few interviewers have said it was a nice touch.
Now if you had a resume like
Deliver Driver, Domino's Brought pizza to customers promptly Handled bills up to $50 (but no more) Dealt with maps and phones daily
It might be a problem. |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:56 PM Author: diverse poppy clown i used to be paranoid about having a huge gap in my resume (which I do anyway) but now i think it doesn't matter at all. it's the type of inane shit that only recruiting and hr people care about.
i wouldn't bother putting a job like a waiter on the resume. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:49 AM Author: fragrant chapel haunted graveyard Yeah bro, right on! Recruiting people are totally irrelevant to getting jobs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348055) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:01 AM Author: flatulent plaza idea he suggested tcr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348142) |
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Date: March 9th, 2010 11:59 PM Author: violent chocolate national I always listed stuff like this. Never had a problem with it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347523) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:04 AM Author: Spruce tantric tank you launched your career during better times as well (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348164) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:07 AM Author: violent chocolate national not so much (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348194) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:08 AM Author: Spruce tantric tank the early 80s recession doesnt count; everything came back within a year (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348197) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:10 AM Author: violent chocolate national listening to the general overplanning and indecisiveness on this board about every/anything, I have to feel some of your problems are of your own making. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348209) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:19 AM Author: Lascivious claret mother hunting ground I listed my menial jobs while in college and while applying to law school. I was told by my OCS to leave them off when applying for actual jobs, this summer. I left one of my cooler menial jobs on, though (still menial, but it involved auto repair for the gov in an exotic location, something I don't think they see too often...it's a good talking point).
During college, I had some menial cashier job when I wasn't doing that repair work. I tend to leave that off, now. But, yeah, I think it is a bunch of BS to do nothing because you are 'too good' for it. That is such a bad attitude toward work. Even the most mind-numbing job gives you cash and helps teach you what you do NOT want to do the rest of your life (it's for a summer, after all). Plus, you learn respect for people from all walks of life. My parents would not have stood for me going back home and not working. There would have been no support, and it wouldn't have happened. They did not give me money during the summers.
And, no, I am hardly a 'prole' (which is an attitude with which I disagree anyway...but that is for another rant). Went to a T10 college, now at CCN. Good family background, but encouraged to earn $ on my own and experience the working world, which was quite a nice way of seeing the real world. Did not care for some unpaid paper-pusher internship at MS or Citi or whatever. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:28 AM Author: violent chocolate national one of my menial jobs, two of the people who interviewed me had also done. Not that it helped me but it helped break the ice with a few laughs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347827) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:33 AM Author: Lascivious claret mother hunting ground Yeah, it is not as if these jobs connect to anything about the law. And, I did them before I even knew I wanted to go to LS. But, I did learn a lot from them: I earned money, I was able to live by myself in a cool place for a summer while making end's meet (for the repair one), I didn't have to go back to boring suburbia, etc. This wasn't through any sort of connection--I knew nothing about repairing stuff, went to the place, applied for jobs by just walking up to places, and it worked. Same with my cashiering. And nobody cared where the hell I went to school--it was quite refreshing, to be honest. Totally different environment. It's a good learning experience, I feel. Also, at least when younger in college and looking for other jobs, it shows you are willing to go do whatever job is out there and work hard at it (I'm not saying that for applying for jobs while in LS...just other summer jobs while in undergrad) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347901) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:36 AM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house lol was that in the 80s? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347932) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:39 AM Author: Lascivious claret mother hunting ground (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347966) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:40 AM Author: Contagious step-uncle's house my post was aimed at bothered. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14347973) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:47 AM Author: violent chocolate national sometimes you should try harder unless you are shooting for the laughtrack (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348037) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:54 AM Author: Carnelian Sanctuary Perfectly fine for college applications or college jobs, but I wouldn't put it on a resume if you're trying to get a job as a lawyer, banker, consultant etc....
If a friend of mine got layoffpwned, ran out of money, and worked at Applebee's to get some extra cash I would not advise that friend to put Applebee's on his resume. It just looks silly, unprofessional, and out of place considering everything else that could already be on the resume.
If I was looking at the resume of someone who got layoffpwned from a law firm or a bank I'd rather just see a resume gap and assume the person did whatever the hell they wanted to with his or her time off.
I'd say that there was a case for including volunteer work, educational courses, unpaid internships and even certain contract attorney positions on a resume. Maybe even include a "menial" job if it involves an interesting or charity-oriented story, such as building houses in Africa or legitimately studying mixology under a legit mixologist. If the story has some entrepreneurial leaning it could also be included, such as if beauty has always been a hobby of yours and you opened your own nail salon. I'd even prefer seeing "sailed around the world between March 2009 and December 2009" on the "Hobbies" section than Applebee's.
No one cares if you've worked at Applebee's during a college summer. Unless you're doing something like an internship or fellowship, no one needs to know about what you did during any summer while in college. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 12:55 AM Author: hideous flirting property feces i've been racking my brain for ~2 hours for a way to turn "empty gap" into some kind of vagina joke, but it's just not coming. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1246179&forum_id=2#14348087) |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:01 AM Author: Demanding den potus "An empty gap is begging for MOARDONGSPLZ"
not perfect, but a start. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 1:04 AM Author: Embarrassed To The Bone Cruise Ship It depends what else is on the resume. If you have lots of more relevant internships or jobs to write about, leaving a gap is appropriate. You don't have space for everything. Same goes for someone with extensive professional experience who has a job for a few months while layoffpwned. People will know you were laid off either way, and won't care what you did.
If you just don't have a lot of experience period, it's far better to show you've at least held a job and have basic employee skills than to make it appear that you've never done anything but go to school and hang out in your masturbation fort. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 2:07 AM Author: curious fuchsia weed whacker range Subject: ALL OF YOU ARE FUCKING RETARDS .....just lie
How many times have you had some bullshit summer internship you did x summers ago verified? Half the people at that ibank you worked at aren't there, and because it was unpaid- you probably didn't have any paperwork.
When I was an unpaid intern at an investment bank, VC, and PE shop- I never filled out any paperwork. Just showed up, shut up, and did as I was told. Very few people even knew my name.
Did it matter? No. I still put it on my resume, and I still get the interview. If you have the know-how and terminology down during the interview, they're not gonna really care about or verify the accuracy of your resume. |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 2:23 PM Author: Sticky nubile volcanic crater azn this reminds me that my CV is an empty gap
im fucked |
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Date: March 10th, 2010 2:25 PM Author: bateful pontificating whorehouse hissy fit I was hired precisely because I had "Burger King, 1998-2000" on my resume. An employer thought it meant I had a real head on my shoulders and wasn't some toolish striver trust fund kid.
Now, of course, I generally leave it off because my resume's getting too fucking long. |