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Arthur Laffer: The Real 'Stimulus' Record (WSJ)

In country after country, increased government spending acte...
Offensive alpha stage
  08/07/12
this guy should be drawn and quartered.
khaki pungent home lettuce
  08/07/12
Whoa. U mad?
Offensive alpha stage
  08/07/12
Lol just lol @ Laffer have any cred at all
avocado dashing crackhouse gunner
  08/07/12
Why doesn't he?
Offensive alpha stage
  08/07/12
because everything he says is self-evidently retarded
metal titillating dopamine circlehead
  08/07/12
The op-ed seems ok.
Offensive alpha stage
  08/07/12
All of his major work was revealed to be epic flame
avocado dashing crackhouse gunner
  08/07/12
Link?
Offensive alpha stage
  08/07/12
for one thing he interpolates concave parabolas whenever he ...
180 indian lodge
  08/07/12
thats what happens when you draw up your major theories on a...
Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter
  08/07/12
this
180 indian lodge
  08/07/12
Paul Krugman fanbois MAF
Aggressive crotch fanboi
  08/07/12
this is incredibly dumb. gov spending as a percentage of gdp...
Comical sexy national security agency
  08/07/12
this op-ed is completely laughable. he's only looking at 200...
Gaped library people who are hurt
  08/07/12
...
khaki pungent home lettuce
  08/07/12
that's why they call him Art "LOL" Laffer it's ...
metal titillating dopamine circlehead
  08/07/12
You mean a prominent economist supported his position by usi...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
...
fragrant potus
  08/07/12
The wsj is getting to be bad as fox news
Navy infuriating pocket flask
  08/07/12
b-b-but MICHAEL JORDAN! http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1...
180 indian lodge
  08/07/12
There's a big big difference between getting right-wing acad...
Deranged spot keepsake machete
  08/07/12
This is in the editorial section breh, not News. Maybe you s...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
Krugman has 10000 times more credibility than this hack
Navy infuriating pocket flask
  08/07/12
Maybe. But lol, just LOL at Thomas Friedman.
Deranged spot keepsake machete
  08/07/12
^^shitlib
irradiated bull headed chapel
  08/07/12
JUST FUCKING LOL AT KRUGMAN FANBOIS. Guy passes of polit...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
Krugman is very hyperbolic and say some silly things, but hi...
Navy infuriating pocket flask
  08/07/12
Seriously you've shown you have no objectivity with this com...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
I don't think he lies, that is not what hyperbolic means.
Navy infuriating pocket flask
  08/07/12
Hyperbole implies a certain degree of dishonesty. If I say I...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
It depends, I think he tells the truth. He just uses extreme...
Navy infuriating pocket flask
  08/07/12
Yes of course, it depends. If you happen to agree with his p...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
if he believes the points the is making his not lying, is he
Navy infuriating pocket flask
  08/07/12
(guy describing exactly what laffer does except laffer has v...
Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter
  08/07/12
...
khaki pungent home lettuce
  08/07/12
If you notice, I'm not actually supporting Laffer (he is a m...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
ok fair enough. but i think the wsj is full of this pseudo i...
Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter
  08/07/12
it only seems the same thing, but Krugman's political opinio...
metal titillating dopamine circlehead
  08/07/12
Krugman destroys austerians on the reg. He's a one-man wreck...
Gaped library people who are hurt
  08/07/12
LOL at destroying. He's been exposed as a prolific cherry pi...
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
No he has not. He's usually the one exposing austerian and t...
Gaped library people who are hurt
  08/07/12
this
metal titillating dopamine circlehead
  08/07/12
ROFL, tyty.
Wine messiness nursing home
  08/07/12
It basically is a branch of Fox news
Exhilarant Toilet Seat
  08/07/12
News Corp is TTT
Ebony Church Building
  08/07/12
link to arthur laffer not being a complete joke and partisan...
Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter
  08/07/12
...
avocado dashing crackhouse gunner
  08/07/12
Things debunked ages ago: 1) communism 2) psychics ...
glittery den
  08/07/12
laffer curve makes sense and there's some empirical support ...
bonkers orange senate
  08/07/12
180, I stand with Laffer. Also, his curve thing was spot on.
Naked church idiot
  08/07/12
The Laffer Curve concept is only 1/2 bull crap. http://ww...
yellow theater stage new version
  08/07/12
I don't think there's any disagreement with the Laffer Curve...
Filthy Spectacular Field
  08/07/12
I agree, if you mean that there is disagreement about where ...
yellow theater stage new version
  08/07/12


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:06 AM
Author: Offensive alpha stage

In country after country, increased government spending acted more like a depressant than a stimulant.

By ARTHUR B. LAFFER

http://online.wsj.com/article_email/SB10000872396390444873204577537244225685010-lMyQjAxMTAyMDAwNjAwODY3Wj.html?mod=wsj_valetleft_email

Policy makers in Washington and other capitals around the world are debating whether to implement another round of stimulus spending to combat high unemployment and sputtering growth rates. But before they leap, they should take a good hard look at how that worked the first time around.

It worked miserably, as indicated by the table nearby, which shows increases in government spending from 2007 to 2009 and subsequent changes in GDP growth rates. Of the 34 Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development nations, those with the largest spending spurts from 2007 to 2009 saw the least growth in GDP rates before and after the stimulus.

The four nations—Estonia, Ireland, the Slovak Republic and Finland—with the biggest stimulus programs had the steepest declines in growth. The United States was no different, with greater spending (up 7.3%) followed by far lower growth rates (down 8.4%).

Enlarge Image

Still, the debate rages between those who espouse stimulus spending as a remedy for our weak economy and those who argue it is the cause of our current malaise. The numbers at stake aren't small. Federal government spending as a share of GDP rose to a high of 27.3% in 2009 from 21.4% in late 2007. This increase is virtually all stimulus spending, including add-ons to the agricultural and housing bills in 2007, the $600 per capita tax rebate in 2008, the TARP and Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bailouts, "cash for clunkers," additional mortgage relief subsidies and, of course, President Obama's $860 billion stimulus plan that promised to deliver unemployment rates below 6% by now. Stimulus spending over the past five years totaled more than $4 trillion.

If you believe, as I do, that the macro economy is the sum total of all of its micro parts, then stimulus spending really doesn't make much sense. In essence, it's when government takes additional resources beyond what it would otherwise take from one group of people (usually the people who produced the resources) and then gives those resources to another group of people (often to non-workers and non-producers).

Often as not, the qualification for receiving stimulus funds is the absence of work or income—such as banks and companies that fail, solar energy companies that can't make it on their own, unemployment benefits and the like. Quite simply, government taxing people more who work and then giving more money to people who don't work is a surefire recipe for less work, less output and more unemployment.

Yet the notion that additional spending is a "stimulus" and less spending is "austerity" is the norm just about everywhere. Without ever thinking where the money comes from, politicians and many economists believe additional government spending adds to aggregate demand. You'd think that single-entry accounting were the God's truth and that, for the government at least, every check written has no offsetting debit.

Well, the truth is that government spending does come with debits. For every additional government dollar spent there is an additional private dollar taken. All the stimulus to the spending recipients is matched on a dollar-for-dollar basis every minute of every day by a depressant placed on the people who pay for these transfers. Or as a student of the dismal science might say, the total income effects of additional government spending always sum to zero.

Meanwhile, what economists call the substitution or price effects of stimulus spending are negative for all parties. In other words, the transfer recipient has found a way to get paid without working, which makes not working more attractive, and the transfer payer gets paid less for working, again lowering incentives to work.

Enlarge Image

Getty Images

But all of this is just old-timey price theory, the stuff that used to be taught in graduate economics departments. Today, even stimulus spending advocates have their Ph.D. defenders. But there's no arguing with the data in the nearby table, and the fact that greater stimulus spending was followed by lower growth rates. Stimulus advocates have a lot of explaining to do. Their massive spending programs have hurt the economy and left us with huge bills to pay. Not a very nice combination.

Sorry, Keynesians. There was no discernible two or three dollar multiplier effect from every dollar the government spent and borrowed. In reality, every dollar of public-sector spending on stimulus simply wiped out a dollar of private investment and output, resulting in an overall decline in GDP. This is an even more astonishing result because government spending is counted in official GDP numbers. In other words, the spending was more like a valium for lethargic economies than a stimulant.

In many countries, an economic downturn, no matter how it's caused or the degree of change in the rate of growth, will trigger increases in public spending and therefore the appearance of a negative relationship between stimulus spending and economic growth. That is why the table focuses on changes in the rate of GDP growth, which helps isolate the effects of additional spending.

The evidence here is extremely damaging to the case made by Mr. Obama and others that there is economic value to spending more money on infrastructure, education, unemployment insurance, food stamps, windmills and bailouts. Mr. Obama keeps saying that if only Congress would pass his second stimulus plan, unemployment would finally start to fall. That's an expensive leap of faith with no evidence to confirm it.

Mr. Laffer, chairman of Laffer Associates and the Laffer Center for Supply-Side Economics, is co-author, with Stephen Moore, of "Return to Prosperity: How America Can Regain Its Economic Superpower Status" (Threshold, 2010).

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278844)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:10 AM
Author: khaki pungent home lettuce

this guy should be drawn and quartered.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278855)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:14 AM
Author: Offensive alpha stage

Whoa. U mad?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278875)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:12 AM
Author: avocado dashing crackhouse gunner

Lol just lol @ Laffer have any cred at all

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278864)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:15 AM
Author: Offensive alpha stage

Why doesn't he?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278878)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:16 AM
Author: metal titillating dopamine circlehead

because everything he says is self-evidently retarded

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278884)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:19 AM
Author: Offensive alpha stage

The op-ed seems ok.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278903)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:16 AM
Author: avocado dashing crackhouse gunner

All of his major work was revealed to be epic flame

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278885)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:19 AM
Author: Offensive alpha stage

Link?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278901)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:35 AM
Author: 180 indian lodge

for one thing he interpolates concave parabolas whenever he sees two points on a graph...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/70/Neo-Laffer_curve.svg/600px-Neo-Laffer_curve.svg.png

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278955)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:40 AM
Author: Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter

thats what happens when you draw up your major theories on a cocktail napkin

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278974)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:34 AM
Author: 180 indian lodge

this

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278952)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:15 AM
Author: Aggressive crotch fanboi

Paul Krugman fanbois MAF

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278879)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:21 AM
Author: Comical sexy national security agency

this is incredibly dumb. gov spending as a percentage of gdp is going to increase more in countries that suffer greater negative economic shocks in the private sector...

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278914)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:28 AM
Author: Gaped library people who are hurt

this op-ed is completely laughable. he's only looking at 2006-2007 to 2008-2009 and comes to the sweeping generalization that stimulus doesn't work. his data has zero credibility: http://uneasymoney.com/2012/08/06/arthur-laffer-anti-enlightenment-economist/

this is complete and utter garbage.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278932)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:29 AM
Author: khaki pungent home lettuce



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278935)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:33 AM
Author: metal titillating dopamine circlehead

that's why they call him Art "LOL" Laffer

it's a laugh a minute with -- Laffer!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278950)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:36 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

You mean a prominent economist supported his position by using manipulated data?? Wow, I guess I've seen it all now.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278958)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 10:15 AM
Author: fragrant potus



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279121)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:38 AM
Author: Navy infuriating pocket flask

The wsj is getting to be bad as fox news

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278962)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:39 AM
Author: 180 indian lodge

b-b-but MICHAEL JORDAN!

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303649504577492300632472284.html

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278969)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:39 AM
Author: Deranged spot keepsake machete

There's a big big difference between getting right-wing academics to argue their position using straw man arguments and cherry picked data vs. just making shit up.

WSJ does the first; Fox does the second.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278972)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:41 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

This is in the editorial section breh, not News. Maybe you should peruse the absolute shit they print in the Times editorial section before you say that. (That's right I'm looking at YOU Paul Krugman)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278977)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:42 AM
Author: Navy infuriating pocket flask

Krugman has 10000 times more credibility than this hack

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278982)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:42 AM
Author: Deranged spot keepsake machete

Maybe. But lol, just LOL at Thomas Friedman.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278983)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:43 AM
Author: irradiated bull headed chapel

^^shitlib

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278987)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:44 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

JUST FUCKING LOL AT KRUGMAN FANBOIS.

Guy passes of political commentary as economic theory and then hides behind the "credibility" of his Nobel prize when actually challenged on the data he uses to support his hack opinions.

HTH

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278993)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:46 AM
Author: Navy infuriating pocket flask

Krugman is very hyperbolic and say some silly things, but his data is always real. That is what separates him from people like lolaffer.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278997)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:48 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

Seriously you've shown you have no objectivity with this comment. You basically admit that he lies and says thing that may not be true, but that's okay because he supports policies you agree with. And I'm not defending Laffer, but if you can't see that they are both cut from the same cloth, GOD FUCKING HELP YOU.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279005)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:48 AM
Author: Navy infuriating pocket flask

I don't think he lies, that is not what hyperbolic means.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279009)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:51 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

Hyperbole implies a certain degree of dishonesty. If I say I EXAGGERATE the facts, does that mean that I am telling the truth??

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279018)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:53 AM
Author: Navy infuriating pocket flask

It depends, I think he tells the truth. He just uses extreme rhetoric.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279022)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:54 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

Yes of course, it depends. If you happen to agree with his point it's not lying.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279029)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 10:16 AM
Author: Navy infuriating pocket flask

if he believes the points the is making his not lying, is he

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279128)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:46 AM
Author: Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter

(guy describing exactly what laffer does except laffer has virtually no legitimate non-partisan hackery academics to fall back on)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279000)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:47 AM
Author: khaki pungent home lettuce



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279002)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:49 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

If you notice, I'm not actually supporting Laffer (he is a moron). But both him and Krugman attempt to disguise what are really political opinions as economic policy.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279011)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:51 AM
Author: Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter

ok fair enough. but i think the wsj is full of this pseudo intellectual conservative bullshit these days, it's so transparent

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279019)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:57 AM
Author: metal titillating dopamine circlehead

it only seems the same thing, but Krugman's political opinions have the data on their side.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279044)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:46 AM
Author: Gaped library people who are hurt

Krugman destroys austerians on the reg. He's a one-man wrecking crew. His columns are awesome.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279001)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:48 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

LOL at destroying. He's been exposed as a prolific cherry picker of data to support his theories.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279008)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:55 AM
Author: Gaped library people who are hurt

No he has not. He's usually the one exposing austerian and trickle-down hacks.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279032)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:58 AM
Author: metal titillating dopamine circlehead

this

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279048)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:59 AM
Author: Wine messiness nursing home

ROFL, tyty.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279053)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 11:14 AM
Author: Exhilarant Toilet Seat

It basically is a branch of Fox news

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279468)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 1:33 PM
Author: Ebony Church Building

News Corp is TTT

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21280257)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:39 AM
Author: Citrine fighting hall faggot firefighter

link to arthur laffer not being a complete joke and partisan hack?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278968)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:40 AM
Author: avocado dashing crackhouse gunner



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278976)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 10:02 AM
Author: glittery den

Things debunked ages ago:

1) communism

2) psychics

3) the laffer curve. (I mean, seriously?)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279059)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 11:19 AM
Author: bonkers orange senate

laffer curve makes sense and there's some empirical support for it, it's not really that crazy. the big problem is that reptile politicians use it to justify and sort of tax cut even though we likely haven't been on the right side of the curve in some time.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279496)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 10:53 AM
Author: Naked church idiot

180, I stand with Laffer. Also, his curve thing was spot on.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279355)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 12:09 PM
Author: yellow theater stage new version

The Laffer Curve concept is only 1/2 bull crap.

http://www.igmchicago.org/igm-economic-experts-panel/poll-results?SurveyID=SV_2irlrss5UC27YXi



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279748)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 12:46 PM
Author: Filthy Spectacular Field

I don't think there's any disagreement with the Laffer Curve, is there? Only where we currently are on the curve?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279951)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 7th, 2012 1:24 PM
Author: yellow theater stage new version

I agree, if you mean that there is disagreement about where on the curve tax rates start to inhibit growth or revenue.

I also think the Laffer type analysis is much different if you are dealing with capital gains taxes as opposed to income taxes.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21280179)