I appreciate the album, but don't think it's classic material.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428305)

college dropout and the other soul-sample early albums are mostly revered by 2000s white college students because that is the most accessible party rap for your average chubby white person with just a passive interest in hip-hop. they aren't that terrific when you go back and listen to them, outside of the singles.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428320)

As for Yeezus being more experimental than Fantasy, I just don't see it. I feel like "who will survive in america" was basically a conceptual prelude to Yeezus.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428362)

I like a variety of hip-hop. Growing up in NYC during the 90s made me partial to Biggie/Jay-Z/Nas, etc. I do appreciate the west coast stuff of that era, and The Chronic, I think is and always will be the single best hip hop album of all time.

Other groups I respect are the Roots, Outkast, and Common.

I do not enjoy rap that's self-aggrandizing for it's own sake. It's part of the territory, but some artists just push it too far. There's only so many times that I can hear Rick Ross say

"UGH! UGH! UGH!

I'm a drive my MAYBACH.;

I'ma sell some powder;

My niggas always stay black;

Eatin' dat clam chowda."

It just gets repetitive.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428436)

i don't have a problem with materialistic and nihilistic rap lyrics. people always bitch about this, but are other genres of music that much deeper or more interesting? the humor and introspection in most rap songs is at least something. the average rock song is just like "baby i love you!" or some kind of lame metaphoric slice of life imagery. no pop music is deep and it's not supposed to be. it's a fucking nerdy and trite complaint.

rappers talk about maybachs and dumb ethnic fist-pump hood shit because it rocks the crowd. it's acknowledged as stupid and easy - intellectual content is not really the point. and a lot of it is more self-referential and clever than they get credit for. i don't see greater inherent value out of spacey stoner lyrics in some well-heeled psych rock song about the ennui of modern suburban life vs. gucci mane going on some weird jag about fucking bitches in the ass when he's on some pills. expression doesn't have to be hogtied to intellectual pretension to get the point across, and with a medium like mainstream hip-hop it's arguable a detriment to the point of the music, which is having a good time and getting caught in the moment.

also, if kanye or other facile rappers all of a sudden tried to pull some nas or guru shit and become social critics and lay on more intricate rhymes, everyone would laugh and accuse them of trying too hard. it's a balance and it seems weird to me to criticize vapid lyrical content in rap when it's a pretty universal trait in popular music.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428457)

It's just the formulaic shit that gets to me. When Biggie said "Money, Ho's and Clothes, all a nigga knows", that was great. When 50 said "Money, money, money, I get money, money, money, I run New York. Money, Money, money, I get money, money, money" 15 years later, it just wasn't as amusing anymore.

As for the fact that most rock music is shit now, I have no argument to refute that. It is shit. The only thing I can really add is to point out that lyrics are more important to the hip hop medium than they are to the rock and roll medium, which tends to focus less on lyrics, and more on instrumentation.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428488)

so far shit being formulaic, i agree that it's grating at times, but i will also defer to my previous argument and say that every genre of popular music gets very formulaic. the only real way to get around lyrical cliches in any genre is to go abstract, and i think kanye does a good job of approaching that while still remaining accessible. there are dozens of spacey abstract weed rappers and socially conscious dudes who make every rap political. they serve a niche. but when you're addressing kanye's audience from kanye's perspective, what the fuck do you really want? a song about the state of modern politics? a 110 IQ bro like kanye waxing philosophical on the human condition? social dialogue about progressive politics? quotidian slice of life observations?

the dude really can't win. he always raps in a fiarly personal and confessional manner, which i think is about the most you can ask for. when you listen to a kanye west album, the main attraction is kanye west, not his fascinating insights into the deconstructed state of our information age lives. and, it's a fucking banger record. the idea is to blend a few nuggets of wisdom with scream-along punchlines.

i don't know. i guess i just think you're approaching the medium with kind of a myopic perspective.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428549)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_H2rJ3J0OmU

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2286319&forum_id=2#23428367)