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On racism and achievement
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Date: May 28th, 2017 1:56 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I have been watching some moot court competitions today on Youtube. I've got to tell you something on racism and achievement that I hope starts to sink in. Finally.
I see these poor kids of color talking in front of white judges and my heart goes out to them. All you white boys see when such a judge stares you down is your father sternly lecturing you on some teenage shortcoming - you stare back at him defiantly thinking what a better man you're going to become in 30 years. A black girl looks at that white judge and sees 400 years of racial and gender subordination and oppression, or someone who is going home reading articles on black genetic inferiority in his smoking jacket over a brandy.
Yet you fail to see the subconscious triggers that would keep her from juggling a Socratic method style interrogation in the competition, and would even use her nervousness as fodder for your stereotypes.
Not fair. I don't know the ideal way around it but I say judge her on her written skills - let her write the briefs - and step into reality about what she's up against as an oralist. Take this observation and apply it to all other scenarios where a fortiori she won't perform as well under pressure.
That's my perception based on years of observation. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:53 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Lol this is bullshit. 1 the blacks prepared less 2 the blacks have dunning Kruger effects and don't have the humility or modesty you describe. 3 they just aren't smart enough even if they prepared For months. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415637) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:56 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction the weren't just black, one was an asian woman. They were both very well prepared, except for the questions, they were at a 80% successful response rate vs. 95% with the white team - and I seriously believe the questions were delivered with a different tone. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415665) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:59 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Describe said different "tone." In the most coddling environment possible. "tone" ljl. Asian chicks fold because they are Asian and chicks. Not good combo for oral argument. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:01 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415713) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:01 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction ljl at your racist comment. But I will repost my observation on "different tone."
http://xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&mc=42&forum_id=2 |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 4:31 AM Author: disgusting nibblets lol, you noise-generating idiot, the only cr would have been to link to the clip (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419195) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:00 AM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction It's not a clip it's a whole competition and I didn't think you'd have the attention span to sit through it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419254) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:01 AM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria i do. link it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419255) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:08 AM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction nah, I get no benefit out of that. Not on this board. You won't see (or admit to seeing) the subtlety. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419261) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:13 AM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria sounds like you're only comfortable having a discussion in which you can claim a monopoly over truth
speaks well of your sense of intellectual security |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:17 AM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Nice flame, in case it is not: notice that there been not one person coming to my side in this thread. Of course, these would be the odds that you would expect a black law student to handle and perform flawlessly and equally to everyone else in the law school setting, but no need to expect it of me here. I've already gone through that trial by fire. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419267) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:23 AM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria lol
you are flame but it's a nice performance art to show how intellectual standards at elite schools have fallen outside of stem |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:06 AM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman This is how educated blacks are (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419312) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:17 AM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman This is ridiculous. We are just supposed to take your word on "tone" because you are black? Things dont work like that. Or at least they are not supposed to, outside of places like Africa. Where there's no scholarship or progress. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419336) |
Date: May 28th, 2017 2:02 PM Author: soul-stirring ivory locale Where did you find this? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414878) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:05 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction The moot court competition? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414892) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:06 PM Author: soul-stirring ivory locale So this is not copied and pasted from somewhere? This is actually your opinion? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414902) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:14 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier he's 150 flame. not nearly as funny as tree man. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414960) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:16 PM Author: rose bespoke fanboi (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418030) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:15 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Yes. I'm actually thinking about it as I watch.
My observation wasn't just about the young black woman. She was paired with a young Asian woman who I thought was incredibly prepared. But then the old white male judge asked her a question, and wouldn't let her give a nuanced answer but just kept saying "I think you should be able to answer with a yes or a no," and she caved - worse than the black girl. That judge didn't stare down either of the white oralists that way. In fact, I feel like the white team confronted a much more collegial atmosphere with the white male jurists, almost mirthful at one point.
And you can tell that the team of color just started out more rigid and anxious, but I don't think that their more harrowing experience was altogether self-fulfilling. Maybe somewhere in the middle.
It's such a shame because I doubt either one of the girls of color is going to win best oralist, and yet they no doubt poured hours into the preparation.
That's racism and achievement in America. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:15 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier You're trying too hard (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414971) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:17 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I'm not trying at all, just giving my observations. You couldn't have taken the time to digest what I just wrote because I just wrote it. Come back when you've had a moment to think about your answer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414979) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:18 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier Come back when you've gotten the dildo out of your ass. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414983) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:24 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Seriously hope you're not a lawyer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415015) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:30 PM Author: Concupiscible place of business tanning salon Lawyers are Jews. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415070) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:00 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415340) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 4:21 AM Author: Dashing Lilac Kitchen Telephone (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419185) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 4:32 AM Author: disgusting nibblets no, the bort, cretin (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419196) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:13 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma that's all fine, but then her well-spoken, organized, and perceptive opponent steps up and destroys her. where does the hand holding end? at some point you're just cultivating mediocrity, which isn't fair to her either. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:15 PM Author: soul-stirring ivory locale Who cares about fairness. Africans are an evolutionary dead end who only thrive in a white world. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414967) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:19 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma sure, if she hits a dead end then that's that. but the fair thing to do is evaluate her as you would anyone else, and guide her like any other law student. if she can't hang that's on her. the coddling is disingenuous though - it's done because you believe she's inferior and can't overcome her psychological issues, which if true, she shouldn't even be there in the first place and you should tell her so. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33414989) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:28 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction credited - I'd take it a step further and say that being an oralist is not the only thing one can do in the legal profession - and in fact, it's not a skill that's required to be any other kind of lawyer other than a litigator (e.g., corporate, tax, real estate, etc).
But when these videos go viral on Youtube I just worry it gives the wrong impression of what people of color are capable of, in the profession or generally. And it's also a very visible way that students, as audience members, get to critique each other without assessing any of their other skills that are not so visible - and it perpetuates very unfair stereotypes. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:04 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Black people are not capable of practicing law at the same rate as white populations. But we coddle them, notwithstanding the mean "tone" sometimes. Dat tone rayciss, judge! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415734) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:05 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Actually that's not true, but there may be specific challenges in certain settings. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415741) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:51 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415629) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:23 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I'm not disputing that.
I would have never strived to be a litigator, I *know* my head and mouth will never be completely connected the way a well-bred and carefully nurtured students would be.
But I am a hell of a writer, and the chief justice of the competition even said that these cases are won on the briefs not at oral argument.
So the answer might be, put the pen in their hands and shut up about the genetic inferiority theories for a couple of generations. Back before there was any HYS and you were all taught in law offices, getting whipped and bringing coffee to the lawyers - you have no way of knowing whether you were any better than that black girl on the podium getting stared at in the eye by a scary white old. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:29 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma the same idea applies to her writing.
look, i went through this myself. my parents didn't go to college and i coasted through shitty public schools looking like a genius. i LSAT'd my way into a t14 that culturally i simply didn't belong in. i remember getting a c+ in con law and looking at the a+ and being floored. i couldn't have written it in a month, much less 3 hours. it was fucking hard on me, but in the end it was the right thing to do because compared to the people i will be up against for the rest of my career, i deserved a c+, not some "well let's evaluate his writing in light of his upbringing in a trailer park" bullshit. being told i sucked /made/ me get better at it. if instead i had gotten "pretty good for white trash" i'd still suck. quality is objective. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 2:55 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I'm in no way saying that inferior writing, analytical or other legal skills should be accepted. But I think the deck was stacked against the non-white team in this moot court competition.
Further, what's interesting is that your rigidity in not understanding my POV is part of the problem. You are not looking at the situation objectively.
Imagine a sporting event where you are given a sandbag, and told that you need to run with it for 500 yards, while your competitors don't. Are you likely to win, even with traits that otherwise put the odds in your favor?
Now, imagine a sporting event where you are given a sandbag, told to hold it for 5 minutes, drop it and then run the race - better chance then?
The sandbag is what the girls are holding in the moot court competition. It is the years of mental impressions in all walks of life that "you can't do it". We can all agree to disagree how heavy the sandbag is, but you have less of a chance when you try to argue that there's no such thing as the sandbag.
The second race is what you, I and those girls are expected to run when we perform any legal task away from the sandbag (ie., the ominous gaze of those judges and our leering moot candidate audience classmates). Things like writing a kick-ass legal brief, drafting a prospectus, even tasks like attending meetings, day to day strategy sessions and advising clients.
We would be such a better society if we understood everything that goes into creating a level playing field and stopped avoiding awkward conversations. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:00 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan I find your thoughts really fascinating as a glimpse into the kind of facile thoughts that go on inside a low-IQ mind on social justice issues. As if you just invent some weird analogy about how minorities are carrying sandbags and accuse others of being part of the "problem" and not being "objective" by accepting its "truth." Id be very interested to learn what kind of LSAT score you achieved. I promise not to mock you - I'm simply curious about what level of mind thinks this way. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415337) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:05 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction You don't sound like a lawyer and if you are, you're quite unread if you think my analogy isn't taken from social justice writings. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415376) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:07 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier state ur iq before i engage u further (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415384) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:08 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan I am a lawyer and went to a far more prestigious law school and more prestigious firm than you did. I find your response fascinating: you think that you don't have to back up the truth of a proposition if you simply say "it's taken from social justice writings"? So if I were to say "I found some writings that disagree with your social justice writings" where the conversation go next? Would this be an insurmountable stalemate? Would we be forced to do anything more than aver to other people's "writings." Where would we go?
edit: I appreciate you're flame though. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:14 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction There is no "far more prestigious" law school than mine, ty, and you don't know what firm I work(ed) for, so I call flame outright. And given that I went to HYP I really doubt you have anything on me.
Ever read any Lani Guinier, or did you just coast through your LS reading "I am a white man and can perpetuate my white man law into perpetuity" treatises? Which is entirely doable.
Fire away with your opposing theories, I am sure they are fascinating. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:19 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan Of course I wouldn't waste my time in law school reading SJW theorists. Is she a neuroscientist? If not, on what grounds would she say that some people are incapable of speaking in front of judges? Please elaborate...
what LSAT got you into HYS? |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:25 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I said HYP, which is UG. I didn't say what law school I went to, and this isn't resume time. Where'd you go to LS? Because it's a shame that whatever law school you went to you didn't read the writings of the first black female law professor at Harvard, yet your hubris allows you to post as if you have some understanding of the subject. That's typical of a lot of white males I know. But it does tell me where your heart is on this matter: that you're not capable of engaging in a discussion that would move the conversation forward in a productive way. I really can't believe you've never picked up one of her books, not even out of curiosity. Shame. You know nothing of this subject matter. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415480) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:35 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan Rather than name dropping, do you care you engage in some reasoned analysis? Can you please state the basis for the claim that certain people can't think straight in front of judges other than just saying so? Somewhere in your HYP education someone must have told you that debate isn't just name dropping and accusing others of bias, you have to actually state the basis of an assertion and allow it to be subject to debate. Please go ahead. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415526) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:46 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction You don't even know who she is????????? I can't get past that to have this conversation with you - nor do I need to. My observations were about this specific competition, and to my knowledge no studies were done on that event. I'm sure I could commission a team of social justice theorists to give their impressions on the disparate treatment at the event, and link the impressions (to your satisfaction of course!) to studies on how people perform less optimally when put into confrontational situations. But I will leave some of that to the realm of common sense, which yes even good studies allow for in a footnote when things are patently obvious - or should be, at least to someone working for a *prestigious firm* and coming from a *prestigious law school*. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415593) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:49 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan To summarize, you base your thesis that minorities perform worse in moot court because they are carrying bags of sand on "common sense" that is "patently obvious"? You are correct that this would not fly at a prestigious firm or law school. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415613) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:53 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction And yet, it does fly at law school because this is the sort of social theory that top law professors write about frequently, you just have to pick up a book every once in a while. If indeed you even went to law school (or a prestigious one, as I doubt that anyone at HYS wouldn't have heard of Lani Guinier). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415641) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:57 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan Actually top professors support their arguments with facts. So please elaborate on the supporting facts. I don't know where you think averring to "top law professors" is getting you. Please go ahead and explain the basis for the claim. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415673) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:00 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction You seriously can't be a lawyer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415696) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:01 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan You seriously can't think that you've made any argument here at all. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415706) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:04 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I've already made the argument; you're the one who can't seem to see what it is. If you had a top-notch legal education, you would stop asking for evidence that isn't necessary to the context. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415735) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:05 PM Author: abusive up-to-no-good coldplay fan "asking for evidence isn't necessary"
tyft |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:06 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Not sure what you think you've proven, but it's not anything from my perspective. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415754) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:38 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415546) |
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Date: June 17th, 2017 9:23 AM Author: Razzmatazz crawly center 180 post (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33579690) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:06 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Ugh, a sweeping victory for the white team. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415381) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:20 PM Author: Concupiscible place of business tanning salon This whole thread is autism. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415457) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 3:26 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415483) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:40 PM Author: contagious splenetic stain (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33415970) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:41 PM Author: Histrionic Gaping go start your own civilization go practice law in haiti |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 4:49 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I can see how charged this subject is, but I will not be moved away from the meaning of my original post.
I am not asking for special accommodations, merely common understanding for why skills appear in different people as they do.
This is more for an audience that would propound theories such as generic inferiority.
It is not a request that minorities who are not qualified move up the ladder. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:16 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman No, its bullshit. Blacks can't write briefs either on balance. And that's G loaded. You can comfort urself w thoughts of classism, but bottom line, the smartest blacks get pwned against simply smart whites. Again and again. And its genetic. Aa dn affirmative action ia bullshit and everyone knows it. Deal w it. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:19 PM Author: aphrodisiac milky trust fund (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417363) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:28 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Where is your evidence to back this up? I can tell you that I run circles around many of my white colleagues in my area of practice, and even have some reporting to me. I don't have to deal with anything, it is you who has to deal with the fact that you could be one of those people some day.
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:32 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Where is my evidence? Lol. Achievement gaps across the world. Iq gaps across the world. Anatomical cranial differences between the races.
Now tell me some more anecdotal garbage about how you happen to kick ass.
This is why I hate hate dealing with blacks on this subject. They just don't get it. And when pushed they end w how "das rayciss" or "i got a BMW." |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:36 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Tell me one thing you've ever done to advance race relations, one philanthropic cause you've advanced, and we'll all side with you. But you have to get me to believe it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417472) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:40 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman I just, I can't understand this response. I have no idea how it has any bearing on anything we are discussing. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417489) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:44 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction It speaks to your character. Nothing about your posts indicates an interest in advancing this discussion respectfully and if you were able to show me that you have an interest in advancing race relations in any other context I might consider that you are approaching this issue in good faith. Sorry, I don't see it and it's probably too late for you to convince me otherwise. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417506) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:06 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Lol at "good faith" not being racial realist, you mean.
The way to advance race relations is to create policies in a race realist perspective.
Edit: Btw I am having trouble following the sequence of your thoughts. Are you sure your a good writer? |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:25 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma i dont entirely disagree with your stupid sandbag analogy, but what's to be done about it? we're talking about real lives and big money here. no one's going to hire a racer with a sandbag, nor should they.
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:34 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction My analogy was just to clear up a misunderstanding with an earlier poster. (S)he was saying I was wrong about my observation in the first sandbag scenario by giving me an example from his life in the second sandbag scenario.
I don't suggest a solution that would have an adverse impact on anyone's business or on the practice of law. I simply think that one should recognize talent and skill sets and give people their best chance to perform with them, that blacks are perfectly capable of being excellent lawyers in many areas, that there may be a weak spot that has a social construct to it, not a genetic one, and that whites need to quit with the intelligence crap, it's very disrespectful and overall it's bullshit. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:36 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma most legal practice doesn't require a genius intellect and smart blacks are going to do just fine, but you gotta admit these people don't belong at v10s or DOJ or whatever. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417473) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:39 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction No, I Don't have to admit that! My comment is simply about their appearance in court in front of a bunch of old guard white males!! That's the extent of it. I went to LS with blacks who made partner at V10s. I was in study groups with them. They absolutely deserve to be there.
I don't see why there is such rigidity with white kids on stuff like this. You're incorrect and need to DEAL with the fact that there are smart black people out there. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:41 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Jfc blacks. I think most race realists would agree there are smart blacks. That's not how it works. Christ on a crutch. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417493) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:42 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma of course there are, it's a statistical certainty, but that doesn't negate the wildly different averages between blacks and everyone else. i genuinely feel bad for smart blacks because they are looked at skeptically due to AA and they don't deserve it at all. it really is insidious. the only meaningful solution is generations of slow progression through extraordinary individuals and discouraging (or at least not encouraging) reproduction of the lower classes. blacks in this country were literally selected for on the basis of docility and dumbness. the smart blacks are the ones who captured and sold them. it's fucking horrific but it's not going to be solved in a generation by some misguided feel-good policy. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417497) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:51 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I don't know how I would figure out what percentage of the blacks or whites I went to school with were off the charts smart vs. average. Some of the blacks seemed average to me, as did some of the whites.
Where are these studies that show that blacks who are admitted to law schools in the T14 are for the most part charity cases who can't hack it and end up ringing up people at Walmart? And how do such studies define success in the law, given that there are so many positions a capable lawyer can hold other than being a law firm partner?
Show me the good and nonbiased studies. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:04 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma just look at the SAT, MCAT, LSAT shit and bar passage rates w/r/t mismatch theory. there's no old white man scowling over you on standardized tests.
yes, there are plenty of black kids who are smart enough to be local DAs, crim guys, family lawyers, whatever. there are a handful of blacks are who are smart enough to be at the very top of the profession. but no one should wind up being anywhere based on anything other than their abilities, and all objective measures of intellectual verbal and written ability we have show blacks to be inferior regardless of their parents education level or income. yes i'm well aware a ton of people wind up in places they don't belong due to connections, and while that's bullshit too, it's worse bullshit to make that kind of bolstering official like AA. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:11 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Pretty well said bro (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417667) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:39 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Not sure how this became a thread on AA anyway since this was not an AA discussion. We're unpacking a chicken/ egg problem here, with me advancing in my OP that propounding a racial inferiority theory is patently racist and leads to underperformance in high pressure settings, and you ignoring that and somehow thinking you have the privilege to just go right ahead and advance these theories anyway despite the social costs. But there must be some benefit to offset the costs or you wouldn't be bothering to further the agenda, and it's hard for me to believe that the benefit to you would be to keep that black kid out of your HYS seat.
That said, if we're going to talk about AA, standardized tests etc., I can tell you that I had an LSAT question in the reading comprehension section that CLEARLY was biased in favor of those whose caregivers were either lawyers, political scientists or politicians and had talked to their kids about the issue, because there was a subtlety in it that you just could NOT get on the spot. It assumed knowledge that wasn't part of the fact pattern. That doesn't help all whites, granted, but it does help whites disproportionately to the exclusion of blacks. That's one example, a drop in a rainstorm of advantages that keeps adding up. Like New Deal legislation was dissproportionately advantageous to whites, like Jim Crow was...
There is no study that controls for all of that and you just can't quote me a good nonbiased study on the topics you are trying to advance. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:43 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma your original premise was to place less emphasis on blacks oral presentation in court due to the unbearable pressure of 400 years of white men staring down on them from the bench. how is that not a kind of AA? this thread is about correcting black disadvantages via policy and awareness. also you've yet to address the fact that their deficiencies in writing aren't much different. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417850) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:48 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction That's because I don't see where you've proven any deficiencies in their writing.
And I fail to see how I'm asking for AA by pointing out a reality that flies in the face of your racial genetic inferiority arguments. I'm not asking for anything. Yeah, it may be too much to ask that judges recognize how intimidating they are to young law students and be really careful to treat everyone the same, but on this board my statement that they should just be careful will be read as they should be really REALLY REALLY careful and throw roses at the black students. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:49 PM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria lol @ pretending that you're asking for equality with the judge thing and then spin around and argue for special treatment for blacks through aa (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417880) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:51 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Everyone knows their writing is deficient. That's why blacks get extra tutoring before the ls semester even starts dude. And not just law school. Blacks are the ones who struggle the most w freshman comp. Remedial. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417884) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:53 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction What kind of an answer is that that "everyone knows."? White kids get tutoring all the time. Just because you choose to use the term "remedial" when it comes to black kids, that doesn't make private tutoring any less "remedial." This is an inferior analysis. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417903) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:55 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Gibberish. Yes white kids get tutoring. However there is literally a black boot camp at ls which starts one week before 1l and begins instruction on writing skills. Why is this offered. Everyone knows. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:58 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction That is absolutely asinine. I know of no such course and certainly didn't participate in anything like it, nor did I hear of anything like it. I doubt it's the norm elsewhere either. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417938) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:00 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Your right. I should have said that everyone knows that blacks are writing mastermen. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417946) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:55 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma a lot of writing ability or lack thereof is due to shitty education. i went to shitty public white schools and there was no making up for it by the time i got to law school. i got nailed and had to correct it ASAP or fail. but no one was there in law school coddling my mediocrity. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417919) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:52 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma judges are intimidating to everyone early in the game. why do you think they're not being careful to treat everyone the same? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417895) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:57 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction no trust me, in this one competition I saw one of the judges only asked one tough question and it was to the non-white team, and he didn't just interrupt her when she gave her answer, he made her rephrase the answer as a yes or a no. No one else had to do that, and he didn't ask anything substantive to the white team. Others had to probe deeper and answer questions more fully that were challenging, yes, but that question was particularly intimidating. And another judge basically said he didn't understand the answer that a non-white team member gave, he didn't do that to anyone on the white team. Yeah, yeah, maybe her answer wasn't clear. Well, I thought she made sense. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417930) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:01 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma do you just completely disregard the possibility that the reason the judge was harder on these people was because they weren't as competent? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417956) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:04 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Or that he's not really capable of understanding what he's watching or that he can be objective on any issue of black vs white? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417966) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:07 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction This from the king of comprehension / objectivity. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417986) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:11 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman I dont look at the NBA line up and say Man dats rayciss! For one thing. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417998) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:12 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction If a white man gets on the team I'm sure he'd have a better shot at some respect than a black law student in a sea of white people ever does. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418014) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:18 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma if AA was non-existent, as it is in professional sports, i would have more respect for a black lawyer or doctor than a white one, assuming i didn't know anything else about their background, because i could be reasonably sure they overcame the odds through their ability. like when you see a smaller white guy in the nba, you know that fucker is fast and he can shoot. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418038) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:22 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction But like I've said, you don't get to just whine your way out of the reality of AA. You're living in the privilege of not having to have your government apologize and make reparations for slavery and other policies where whites catapulted ahead of blacks from a socioeconimic standpoint; and instead of appreciating that, you complain about AA. And you don't see how that in itself is racist. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418057) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:38 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma it's a fair point that blacks are starting way behind early white americans due to slavery, but that shit is long gone and plenty of poor people have come to this country since then and made incredible gains in one or two generations. at this point, blacks are carrying the sandbag because they want to. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418156) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:09 AM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419318) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:06 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction before the questioning section began, they were both encyclopedic in their knowledge of the subject matter. Like I said, perhaps a bit more rigid stylistically than the white team, but clearly extremely prepared. I thought the asian girl had a shot at some prizes, but then the old white judge tripped her up. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417979) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:12 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Dem old white judges, they's bad! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418013) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:38 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman AA is what's disrespectful. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417479) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:39 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417488) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:42 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction So was slavery, Reconstruction, Jim Crow laws, New Deal legislation. Deal with it. Are you kept out of any school? No. You just have to work hard, sorry that's life. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417496) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:44 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier *black girl getting into Yale with 2000 sat while azn guy goes to bigstateu with 2300* (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417507) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:55 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction And yet we're still not in a society where the tendency is for the azn to look at the AZN at Yale and see what he needs to do to perform like that. Aren't you even the slightest bit curious to see what got him in at your expense? What makes you think that you "deserve" Yale? Ever think that that black girl needs it more, that (s)he might get more out of it from Yale's perspective? That something about being in that high charged environment for the first time in her life might set her world on fire more than it would the azn guy? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417569) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:03 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier no one "needs" an education more. the azn guy would probably contribute to society with a Yale degree than the black girl (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417605) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:05 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma mismatch studies show it's more likely to squander her talent. she could have been the fucking queen of wherever she came from, but instead she gets beaten down for 3 years by people way out of her league. sure, a few of them will come out of it for the better, but the evidence shows it's discouraging. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417620) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:07 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Absolutely. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417630) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:43 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction I don't know what evidence you're talking about. I like to believe that more stories like mine are possible where I used my seat at these schools to better myself and escape the shackles of a downtrodden life for a much better one. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417851) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:45 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma man that's great and i'm sorry you have to listen to and deal with all this bullshit, but you're an exceptional exception. i am, too; most of the very white community i come from are incompetent. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417858) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:52 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman The evidence the supreme court justice scalia cited to famously in oral argument, for starters. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417897) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:04 AM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction scalia, there's a non-biased source. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419256) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:10 AM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman The study itself was done by blacks you cretin. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419320) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 1:59 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Well, which study are you referring to? There were multiple amicus briefs submitted on either side of the case. At least one was authored by a white woman. And they were directed at very discrete questions, not ones as broad as we are talking about here.
Get your facts straight. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:02 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Jesus at black self congratulation. Christ. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417958) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:47 PM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417869) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:28 PM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria lol
this mentality is why our greatest schools are declining |
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Date: May 31st, 2017 6:15 PM Author: cracking violent orchestra pit blood rage lol at this flame. the AZN actually needs an elite diploma, the black girl can AA her way into UMC life (and if she flames out there's always welfare) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33440020) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:10 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman What on earth is this mush.
Yes slavery etc was disrespectful. And we ended it.
I am harmed personally by aa in any number of ways.
We all should have to work hard. Including blacks.
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:17 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma LO-fucking-L at blacks being kept out of school. the most hallowed halls of academia are doing everything they can to lure blacks in. no population is as sought after. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417699) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:19 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier they're even bringing in literal nigerian princes (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417709) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:20 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma you mean the descendants of the ones who were smart and capable enough to completely conquer and control the ones who wound up here?
through my career and my wife's, i've had exposure to way more than an average amount of nigerian lawyers, doctors, engineers, academics, and pharmacists. they're almost always extremely capable, friendly, calm, and orderly. i wonder why they're so successful?
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:29 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier the few nigerians i've met have all said that they grew up with basically asian work ethic/focus on academics (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417779) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:51 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction doesn't this prove my point though? They don't have 300 years of old white men staring them down with racial inferiority studies rolled up in their hands? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417887) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:53 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma the point is they don't have that shit because they were smart enough to fend it off, while african americans weren't. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417904) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:03 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction why would they have to fend off something that wasn't part of their social construct? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417963) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:08 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Slavery? Slavery wasn't in their social construct? Haven't we discussed this before? Blacks practiced slavery in Africa. This is getting to he a tax on my disappointment in OPs ability to hold his own on the subject. I'm out. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:11 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction Please, go. You clearly can't see that I am describing a distinctly American racial problem and can't see that a black/ black slavery problem half way around the world has nothing to do with that. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418001) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:14 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman But why would the distinction make a different in the other dudes hypothetical? You are not a lawyer. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:27 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&mc=134&forum_id=2#33418044 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418080) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:16 AM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman You are not addressing the fact that you distinguish American.slavery from African slavery in the context of self selection. You argues it but now it seems to subtle a point for you to carry thru. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:09 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma rich white europeans were all up in nigerian's shit, but a handful of them, coincidentally the ones who had been running the show there for generations, managed to keep them at bay by capturing their lesser capable neighbors and selling them to appease the white man, all while learning the white man's ways and successfully adapting to life in the imperialist world. white assholes were and are part of their social construct, but it's not holding them back at all. why? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417994) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:19 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction It's still not homegrown animus, so of course it is processed differently. Most of the uber successful blacks in this country come from not just Africa, but the Carribean as well (where white slavery existed), but they aren't weighed down by years of home grown animus. Think of how you go to a foreign country as a tourist and just see everything great about it and want to move there, only to see the problems possibly years down the road.
But I thought you said that blacks were inferior, and now you are arguing that American blacks are just weak because they can't handle things the way Nigerians do and they aren't inferior? |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:23 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma i'm arguing that african americans, specifically the descendants of the slaves, are on average intellectually inferior to pretty much everyone else in this country. i would wager everything that i own that the ruling class of nigeria are smarter than an average southern american white population. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418061) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:26 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction How convenient and artful of you to have shifted the argument. Forgive me if I won't take that position to have stemmed from a good study on the issues.
If I don't respond to anyone else tonight, it's because I'm headed to sleep. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:32 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma this all comes down to whether or not you think african americans have the ability to succeed even if all else were equal, and i just don't think they do on average. a certain percentage of them will always be exceptional, and they deserve every opportunity anyone else does and any discrimination towards them should be dealt with swiftly and decisively. but there are a bunch of them that just aren't capable of high-level thought in high-stakes situations. and there a bunch of white people who aren't capable of it either. neither of them deserve the benefit of the doubt. if you are capable, you will succeed. it isn't racist, it's just reality. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418114) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:23 AM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction But you don't get to decide (at least not during the short timeframe of your law school application cycle) how the playing field needs to be leveled to give those exceptional black people the chance that they need. Legal and social justice luminaries have been trying to sort this out for generations. Eventually they will get the balance right but it's not as simple a topic as the whites on this board would have it be. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419272) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 11:39 AM Author: heady translucent dilemma it doesn't need to be "leveled" for exceptional blacks. they've got the LSATs and GPAs to get into good schools just like anyone else. it only needs to be "leveled" (total doublespeak, btw) for those who can't hang but still for some reason believe they deserve to run with the best. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419860) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 1:51 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction When you get into the work world, and you gain access to training that will show you all of the components that go into achievement, then we'll talk. In the meantime, you might want to take an online course such as Michael Sandel's "Justice:What's the Right Thing to Do?"
Your viewpoint is more myopic than you seem to think: nurture has a lot to do with achievement, more specifically whether you think you can achieve something and the barriers to that mindset . We're not all on a level playing field on that front and some late bloomers benefit from social institutions such as AA in this regard. |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 2:07 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma i've been working for 18 years, from a bus boy to a general counsel. no one's got time for hand holding past the training period.
as for nurture, what about non-blacks with "barriers"? my dad was a fucking mechanic. how much intellectual nurturing do you think i got? i would have benefitted from some social institutions, too, but it was sink or swim for me. some folks sink, and that's sad and very difficult on them but there aren't unlimited resources to cultivate everyone's talents. if you're not ready when the time comes then it's time to go somewhere else. i agree late bloomers are kind of fucked in this society where you pretty much have to make a plan and stick with it from 18 on, but that issue effects a lot more than just blacks. there are a lot more white, hispanic, and asian kids out there with shitty upbringings that aren't getting any AA. |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 2:46 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction It iseems as if you are deliberately inventing straw men to avoid the real issue, and thereby a solution. No one is arguing that anyone should be handheld past a training period. But to use your parlance to make you more comfortable, school -ALL of that time - IS the training period.
I am sorry for the fact that you haven't received any special accommodations in your life. Life is a shit show for a lot of us. I also started as a busboy etc, and I was assaulted and harassed all through school, including Ivy League schools. Would you prefer that kind of life?
As for your dad, I have no idea whether he was intellectually inclined let alone what kind of a bump would have led him to lead an academic or professional life. As for you and the scores of white immigrants who came to the US and succeeded after a generation or 2, well, perhaps that can give you a window into how easy it is for whites to assimilate and what the barriers of skin colour are, or how insidious the pathology of race relations truly are. It can't just be looked at through your lens of "how I personally should have gotten more help" or my lens of "I'm so glad I did, without it I might be dead." It needs more study and is getting just that. |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 2:55 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma isn't the issue here that blacks are intimidated by the courtroom? don't you think plenty of other people are intimidated by it, but aren't going around asking for and receiving special treatment? i agree that law school is the training period, but you're suggesting that rather than hold them to the same speaking standard as everyone else, we should evaluate them more on their written product, even though when they get out of school they're going to be competing on their verbal presentation in the courtroom, and indeed be evaluated as a professional every day in every verbal interaction they have. does your plan ever circle back around and teach these kids how to talk like a lawyer on their feet? lowering the bar in their education is a disservice because no one is going to lower it in the real world.
i didn't get help due to my lot in life, i shouldn't have, and neither should anyone else. it's not societies role to lift up average people past their limitations. extraordinary people will find their way out as long as their are no structural, legal restrictions in place. if you're being held back by an idea in your head, that's a personal problem. |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 3:13 PM Author: bat-shit-crazy mint dysfunction No, that's not what I said. I said that these judges were not treating the non-white team with the same tone of voice and that their tone was less collegial and more intimidating when addressing the non-white team, that this generally has an impact on performance to the detriment of the non-white team, that this sort of treatment is generally exacerbated by privileged whites running around touting their genetic superiority theories, and that it's a shame that this primarily white audience of students needed to see the beat-down. I was exaggerating a bit, it was a very subtle dynamic. But it did give them (and would have given you) a chance to pat themselves on the back for being white and smarter. I thought I would address that tendency.
But in no way did I say black lawyers should get to argue cases in court if they didn't have to skills to do so.
I also pointed out how these skills aren't necessary for 80% of practice areas, yet your entire post above suggests that you need these skills to be a great lawyer. You don't. I question why modern law schools place such an emphasis on oral advocacy for this reason, these should be electives. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 9:44 PM Author: Exhilarant unholy temple elastic band (not a 12-stepper) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417504) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:27 PM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417769) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:18 PM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria lol
tell us your embarrassing lsat score fgt |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:22 PM Author: shimmering chapel Excellent lib pathology flame (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417728) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:30 PM Author: vibrant fishy hospital mood can someone give us a tl;dr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417791) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:31 PM Author: heady translucent dilemma african americans are whiners. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417800) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:32 PM Author: lavender main people school cafeteria "smart people don't deserve to go to good schools because i feel ashamed for being black and need to be compensated for that" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417806) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:42 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Just as an aside, I've noticed that blacks dont often do well on xox. There's abbot saxtus who dominated, and idris who knows to be guarded now but the remaining blacks just get pwned the fuck out esp on the subject of AA. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417844) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:43 PM Author: Bearded bistre bawdyhouse sound barrier beckersted is a better poaster than you (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417849) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:48 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman I thought he was beaner? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417873) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 4:05 AM Author: 180 really tough guy he's a black latino far as i can tell. like a dominican or a puerto rican (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419176) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:49 PM Author: laughsome national security agency foreskin Some of the best poasters are/were black, actually. Don't agree with his politics but Idris -- when he is not focused on lib shit -- is funny. Beckersted is awesome. Saxtus too. Blue Smoke, say what you will, always brings the crowds. There was also a hot looking black woman from a while back -- can't remember her name, but she was a good poster. She was like the anti-Black Smoke and also drew a lot of comment. Given the percentage of the population and the percentage that you might expect to be on xo, they have a decent showing. WLMAS thoroughly sucks though. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 10:59 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman This is basically what I'm saying. Assuming beckerstead is beaner. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417941) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 10:06 AM Author: Citrine codepig public bath shiveringjenny is good and still reads... even posts once in a while. i also know for a fact she read or reads sailer. 180 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419581) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:04 PM Author: Wonderful milk Killuminati was a good poster. Blue Smoke sometimes was.
Boondocks created this place. |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:01 PM Author: Wonderful milk Or you could have saved a few paragraphs and said, "stereotype threat" or the theory du jour. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33417955) |
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Date: May 28th, 2017 11:15 PM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman I dont think OP is a lawyer. He's flaming pretty hard here. He's too incoherent to be an atty. Even as a minority. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33418028) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 4:35 AM Author: disgusting nibblets I think he is a prime example of AA output. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419201) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:20 AM Author: Know-it-all lemon black woman Its horrible. Tortured logic, ipse dixit conclusions. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419340) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 7:12 AM Author: wine range people who are hurt Oral arguments are flame precisely because of shit like this. It becomes a gotcha game of who says what and how and what the "truth" of anything is actually becomes secondary. This shit right here is why Clarence Thomas is right never to engage is that retarded 18th century BS. Everything should be decided on the papers and this relic of a bygone era needs to die.
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:24 AM Author: Honey-headed Stimulating Ladyboy Marketing Idea Cr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419346) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 1:30 PM Author: Khaki scourge upon the earth turdskin Actually credited. It's often a crutch for lazy judges/clerks who don't want to read the papers thoroughly. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33420659) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 8:02 AM Author: Supple senate pisswyrm WHAT WAS HIS NAME (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33419302) |
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Date: May 29th, 2017 4:10 PM Author: Nudist effete police squad church building (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33421811) |
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Date: June 17th, 2017 9:29 AM Author: multi-colored shitlib legend this is bitchmade donkeyfaggotry. a black girl competing in moot court in front of white judges isn't thinking about slavery and racism. she's thinking about pdf files, AIDS, and yogurt. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3628923&forum_id=2#33579713) |