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2 hr. ago

GeppettoCat

Haley supporter voting for Harris - fellow conservatives what am I missing

Firstly, I posted this in R/ conservative and they deleted the post. I'd love to hear some voices from conservatives here.

A little about me first. Between 2000 and 2020 I voted for the following presidential candidates: Harry Browne (Lib), W, W, McCain, Romney, Trump, Biden. I vote in everything from municipal elections to general and have always voted Libertarian and Republican for candidates until 2020.

This time around I was really excited to be able to cast a vote for Nikki Haley but she lost the primary. I have my serious concerns with former President Trump, which I'll share shortly, which means I won't vote for him and will for Harris. I'm confused how traditional conservatives could vote for Donald Trump at this point and would like to hear your thoughts. But more than hearing your reasons for why you'd vote for DJT as a conservative, I'd really like to hear why my thought process is off base. What I'm expecting is a critique of my point of view and not a strawman or tu quoque that avoids addressing my concerns with DJT and instead focuses on Harris.

Based on these concerns I'm voting for Harris. Does this mean I think Harris is an ideal candidate- Not. At. All. But I will say my concerns leave me trusting her as fit to serve more than DJT and I believe if we can remove him from our party, then we can get quality leadership as we move forward in 2028. I look at myself as playing the long game, rather than the short.

For my concerns, let's assume Trump did a great job during his term. Transparently don't think Trump did a great job in his terms. He had 2 years with majorities in all 3 branches and didn't get Obamacare or the wall where they needed to be. I believe C-19 was handled poorly and that his printing of money for stimulus during C-19 largely contributed to inflation by increasing demand of goods through his stimulus policies at the same time supply was down due to C-19 bottlenecks due to labor shortages. But I want to assume he did a great job, so it doesn't distract from my broader points.

My concerns:

Conservatives put country over themselves when it matters but he didn't do that when it mattered most. - He puts himself over country. This doesn't mean he hasn't done some selfless things for his country, but when it came down to the 2020 election he was willing to tear this country apart more by aggressively and repeatedly telling a nation primed to believe him that the election was definitively stolen from him. He did this despite his family and administration expressing he lost fairly. Anyone could see how telling patriots their election was fraudulent would fracture our democracy and I can't bring myself to vote for someone who put their own needs over the great American experiment. As conservatives we are suppose to put the health of our democracy above all else.

Related to #1. Ashli Babbit and law officers died that day as a result of his rhetoric. Those in Trump's administration acknowledge that he lost the 2020 election and that he's aware of it. For Trump to continually and falsely suggest otherwise infuriated people to the point where they were willing to storm the Capitol because they thought they were defending their nation. He may have told them to march peacefully and patriotically but he wasn't honest about the election. Trump should have been honest with his constituents. Had he done so, Ashli and several others would be alive and with their families. From my standpoint a veteran and several law officers died because DJT was protective of his ego. That's a travesty and poor leadership in my book.

Conservative leaders hold a moral standard that he lacks. His overall temperament demonstrates he isn't fit to lead. I know many people, include friends and family members, who brush off his Tweets/Truths, his name calling, and other insulting rhetoric. For me they are a strong demonstration for how he is unfit to lead. I'd be embarrassed if any of my children acted that way on their social feeds. I simply wouldn't hire any manager underneath me regardless of their results if they treated coworkers they disagreed with the way DJT treats those he sees as adversaries. He even insults and starts fights with private civilians. Regardless of how he feels about a citizen, a leader shouldn't Truth that they hate them, especially when their distaste for any individual repeatedly generates an increase of death threats against those individuals. It's not only improper but also dangerous and irresponsible. DJT even once tweeted angrily at climate activist Greta Thunberg when she was a 16 year old girl at the time. This isn't how leaders should act. It's a poor role model for our children. I can't elect someone for president if I wouldn't hire them to manage my manufacturing line.

DJT isn't truly a conservative. Tariffs are antithetical to free markets and free markets have long been a hallmark of conservatism. The same goes for his stimulus spending. His increases in GDP, which is broken down by consumer spend + government spend + savings and investment, came from increases in government spending, which again goes against typical conservative principles. As a result he also saw large deficits and increases in the debt. If I wanted to vote for these outcomes, I could continually vote democrat. But this isn't what I want and I'd really love to see the party get back to its principles. If we continually follow DJT, we won't.

DJT has a strong authoritarian streak that directly contradicts the liberties on which this nation were founded. Trump has repeatedly mentioned locking up people, typically his political opponents, with an implication it would bypass trial- this was even before his most recent comments regarding the enemy within. He mentions that police officers should use undue force when putting individuals in cars. He repeatedly mentioned during his previous term that he'd go after a 3rd term, which could be a joke, sure, but doesn't pair well when other "jokes" include being a dictator on day one and making sure if he's elected people don't have to vote again. He's used the National Guard to push away protestors. While I'm disgusted at the thought of burning the flag, it is a protected part of free speech and Trump has said he'd lock those people up, too. His proposals for his next term include using impoundment to bypass the role of legislative branch. And on and on. These suggest to me an individual with an authoritarian streak who cares more about what they want to do than they do the constitution and the freedoms and liberties protected within. Harris isn't my favorite and she certainly brings some free speech concerns, but the overall list of authoritarian and outright constitutional concerns she brings appear smaller and less severe. I want to bring back conservatives being the carriers of the constitution and elect someone in 2028 who does just that.

Many of those who have worked most closely with him don't support him. Lifelong, staunch conservatives who served DJT in his administration from Vice President to Department of Defense to Chief of Staff, and so on say he's unfit and that they won't be voting for him and will vote Harris. These are people who have given their lives in service of the Republican party and who also intimately know how DJT operates and say they won't vote for him. People might provide a lot of excuses for why this is the case, but I keep thinking about my cousin and her ex-husband. My entire family loved her ex-husband and I'd text him and call him way more than her. A true bromance. One day she said they were getting a divorce, which shocked me because of how great we all thought he was. The thing is we only saw parts of it. It turns out he was verbally and physically abusive and also cheated. We only saw part of the picture but she was in it and knew who he really was and we had no clue. I imagine his former administration members are like my cousin and we should really be trusting those who know how things are behind the scenes.

If you made it this far, I thank you. This turned out much longer than I planned, but I really wanted to get my thoughts out. I'd really like to hear the perspectives and thoughts you all have on my concerns. It probably won't, but maybe it'll change my mind and I'll see something I haven't. I'm open to that. But for now, I'm here with many other lifelong conservatives types- Dick/Liz Cheney, Mitt Romney, etc- who just can't bring myself to vote DJT again.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5613872&forum_id=2Elisa#48213335)