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Question about European feudalism.

Was this system as singularly shitty as it sounds, or have m...
Nubile abode keepsake machete
  06/14/13
just walk outside bro
sapphire insane casino milk
  05/29/25
(and yes, OP's country has a third world gini coefficient)
sapphire insane casino milk
  05/29/25
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sapphire insane casino milk
  06/03/25
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nyuug
  07/07/26
Have most large-scale agricultural civilizations over the la...
Deep library
  05/29/25
Yes, it was terrible, it was the first form of mass-egalitar...
geriatric gas station multi-billionaire
  05/29/25
(ignores every other form of mass-agriculture that preceded ...
Deep library
  05/29/25
They were better because you had different tribal clans owni...
geriatric gas station multi-billionaire
  05/29/25
read the history of the early hydrological civilizations of ...
Deep library
  05/29/25
Better to be a serf under a Warrior Clique (blessed by the P...
hot athletic conference pistol
  07/01/25
...
Glassy state
  07/13/25
...
talented arrogant nursing home gaming laptop
  07/13/25
what part of: the peasants are revolting, don't u get?
Floppy Hell Friendly Grandma
  05/29/25
cq
Confused genital piercing
  05/29/25
I'd say that like slavery it probably depends on a lot on ju...
marvelous cruise ship partner
  06/03/25
teen black death survivors were the original Boomers
hot athletic conference pistol
  07/02/25
...
Soul-stirring bossy hall
  12/18/25
i wish i could have sworn fealty to an employer like a serf ...
twinkling personal credit line
  06/08/25
Serfs had tons of time off & feast days. It wasn't as ba...
pink chest-beating wrinkle
  07/01/25
really depended on the country, the region, and the lord re...
Spectacular Soggy Parlour
  07/16/25
It worked out really well for most folks. Asia had similar s...
rough-skinned trip pit cuckold
  11/11/25
it was a nanny state.
Metal Heady Weed Whacker Half-breed
  11/24/25
Most societies were nomadic. Home sapiens only became a sett...
rough-skinned trip pit cuckold
  12/08/25
actual feudalism was probably fine and shitty in parts four...
Spectacular Soggy Parlour
  12/18/25
13th century English peasant: 1620 chill working hours per y...
ruddy dragon
  04/23/26
"Before capitalism, most people did not work very long ...
ruddy dragon
  04/23/26


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: June 14th, 2013 10:27 AM
Author: Nubile abode keepsake machete

Was this system as singularly shitty as it sounds, or have most societies historically been based on similar systems?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#23393887)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 4:29 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk

just walk outside bro

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48969812)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 4:30 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk

(and yes, OP's country has a third world gini coefficient)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48969813)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 3rd, 2025 9:24 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48985020)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 8th, 2025 5:55 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48997575)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 1st, 2025 9:14 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49064860)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2025 8:14 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49070377)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 6th, 2025 8:32 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49077411)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 8th, 2025 10:20 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49084518)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 13th, 2025 6:52 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49098591)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 14th, 2025 5:12 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49101058)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 16th, 2025 3:43 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49105012)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 20th, 2025 8:00 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49117359)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 24th, 2025 5:37 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49128622)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 29th, 2025 11:50 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49141968)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 30th, 2025 6:59 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49143857)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 4th, 2025 6:52 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49156580)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 10th, 2025 8:35 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49172980)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 8:33 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49421817)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 8:48 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49421862)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 8:57 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49421881)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 11:28 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49422254)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 12th, 2025 7:15 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49424474)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 12th, 2025 9:29 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49425035)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 13th, 2025 1:21 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49425543)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 13th, 2025 4:52 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49427654)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 16th, 2025 8:27 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49436681)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 16th, 2025 9:03 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49436785)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 17th, 2025 6:11 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49439167)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 18th, 2025 7:01 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49441985)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 23rd, 2025 8:51 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49454945)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 24th, 2025 12:36 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49455274)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 24th, 2025 6:55 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49457596)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 24th, 2025 9:29 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49458108)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 26th, 2025 12:15 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49461550)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 26th, 2025 4:27 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49463581)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 26th, 2025 10:41 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49464738)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 27th, 2025 5:48 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49466319)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 28th, 2025 12:55 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49467160)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 2nd, 2025 6:52 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49478445)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 4th, 2025 5:54 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49484240)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 4th, 2025 9:25 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49484832)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 7th, 2025 7:20 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49492316)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 8th, 2025 12:55 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49493000)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 8th, 2025 8:23 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49495268)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 9th, 2025 3:57 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49497250)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 10th, 2025 9:55 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49500993)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 16th, 2025 9:07 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49515504)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2025 1:04 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49518561)



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Date: December 21st, 2025 8:59 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49529071)



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Date: December 22nd, 2025 8:47 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49532458)



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Date: December 24th, 2025 12:00 AM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49536032)



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Date: December 28th, 2025 6:54 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49545634)



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Date: December 28th, 2025 7:05 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49545665)



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Date: December 29th, 2025 9:19 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49548639)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 4th, 2026 8:56 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49562700)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 6th, 2026 7:39 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49567730)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 12th, 2026 6:44 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49584404)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 14th, 2026 6:47 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49589879)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 20th, 2026 7:47 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49604959)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:08 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49838395)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:38 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49838453)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 13th, 2026 7:20 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49884309)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 19th, 2026 8:56 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49890852)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 21st, 2026 5:25 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49893306)



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Date: May 25th, 2026 6:16 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49900593)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 26th, 2026 8:51 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49903004)



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Date: May 28th, 2026 5:55 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49905466)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 3rd, 2026 5:16 PM
Author: sapphire insane casino milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49913565)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2026 11:56 PM
Author: nyuug



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49985467)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 5:47 AM
Author: Deep library

Have most large-scale agricultural civilizations over the last 5k years relegated the vast majority of their agricultural labor force /population to a state of semi-slavery enforced by an exploitative elite with a monopoly on violence?

yes

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48969854)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 5:51 AM
Author: geriatric gas station multi-billionaire

Yes, it was terrible, it was the first form of mass-egalitarianism. All the old Tribal Clans were abolished & people were turned into landless serfs, the only exceptions were the Elite Warlord Clans that got to rule as Lords/Kings.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48969860)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 5:55 AM
Author: Deep library

(ignores every other form of mass-agriculture that preceded it)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48969863)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 7:47 AM
Author: geriatric gas station multi-billionaire

They were better because you had different tribal clans owning different regions, serfdom was a form of quasi-slavery, only the Kings/Lords had property rights.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48969954)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 1:37 PM
Author: Deep library

read the history of the early hydrological civilizations of egypt, mesopotamia, the indus and the yellow river valleys

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48971066)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 1st, 2025 11:58 PM
Author: hot athletic conference pistol

Better to be a serf under a Warrior Clique (blessed by the Priestly Clique) than a humiliated cog of the Merchant Clique imho

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49065184)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 13th, 2025 6:53 PM
Author: Glassy state



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49098592)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 13th, 2025 7:03 PM
Author: talented arrogant nursing home gaming laptop



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49098608)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 8:52 AM
Author: Floppy Hell Friendly Grandma

what part of: the peasants are revolting, don't u get?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48970037)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 8:54 AM
Author: Confused genital piercing

cq

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48970041)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 3rd, 2025 9:32 PM
Author: marvelous cruise ship partner

I'd say that like slavery it probably depends on a lot on just where you are, so not singularly shitty just situation dependent

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48985033)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 2nd, 2025 12:06 AM
Author: hot athletic conference pistol

teen black death survivors were the original Boomers

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49065206)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2025 4:10 AM
Author: Soul-stirring bossy hall



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49518664)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 8th, 2025 6:07 PM
Author: twinkling personal credit line

i wish i could have sworn fealty to an employer like a serf to a feudal lord when i was younger. would have saved me a lot of pain cycling through shitty short-term jobs.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#48997602)



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Date: July 1st, 2025 10:15 PM
Author: pink chest-beating wrinkle

Serfs had tons of time off & feast days. It wasn't as bad as most people think. They didn't have running water or electricity, but neither did the rulers.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49065026)



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Date: July 16th, 2025 4:01 AM
Author: Spectacular Soggy Parlour

really depended on the country, the region, and the lord

removing technology from the equation it could range from far more harmonious than what we have today to utterly hellish. the general trend towards centralization of power from the early middle ages and on and the rise of the professional state theoretically ensures a general better standard of living for a subject on average, or at the very least a set "floor" for QoL, but ends up removing a lot to do with the nuances of power relations and enduring senses of community in the process

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49105022)



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Date: November 11th, 2025 8:49 PM
Author: rough-skinned trip pit cuckold

It worked out really well for most folks. Asia had similar systems in place for thousands of years and they were stable societies

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49421865)



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Date: November 24th, 2025 10:06 PM
Author: Metal Heady Weed Whacker Half-breed

it was a nanny state.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49458174)



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Date: December 8th, 2025 8:26 PM
Author: rough-skinned trip pit cuckold

Most societies were nomadic. Home sapiens only became a settled species during the most recent 5% of our time on earth. There's absolutely nothing normal (or even good) about anything we do today, unless your goal is simply to put more people on the earth's surface

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49495273)



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Date: December 18th, 2025 1:07 AM
Author: Spectacular Soggy Parlour

actual feudalism was probably fine and shitty in parts

foursquare feudalism otoh is a lot of fun and harmless if it's not infested with faggots

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49518563)



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Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:17 PM
Author: ruddy dragon

13th century English peasant: 1620 chill working hours per year with your bros, downtime all winter, zero "thank" emails

you: hiting 1620 billables in July while on your "working vacation" at the beach with your kids

https://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/users/rauch/worktime/hours_workweek.html

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49838409)



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Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:17 PM
Author: ruddy dragon

"Before capitalism, most people did not work very long hours at all. The tempo of life was slow, even leisurely; the pace of work relaxed. Our ancestors may not have been rich, but they had an abundance of leisure. When capitalism raised their incomes, it also took away their time."

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2Elisa#49838410)