Arthur Laffer: The Real 'Stimulus' Record (WSJ)
| ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,........., | 08/07/12 | | sensitive perverted niggas that dont like drums. | 08/07/12 | | ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,........., | 08/07/12 | | .,,..,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.,:, | 08/07/12 | | ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,........., | 08/07/12 | | .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.. | 08/07/12 | | ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,........., | 08/07/12 | | .,,..,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.,:, | 08/07/12 | | ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,........., | 08/07/12 | | .,.,,..,,.,.,.:.,,;:.,.,,:,.,..,,:,........:..,.:: | 08/07/12 | | OSIRIS | 08/07/12 | | .,.,,..,,.,.,.:.,,;:.,.,,:,.,..,,:,........:..,.:: | 08/07/12 | | Irritable Bowel Shrew | 08/07/12 | | climbing kike mountain | 08/07/12 | | .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,.,,,:::,.;,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | sensitive perverted niggas that dont like drums. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | itwasonthatdayiputajihadonthem | 08/07/12 | | .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,,..,,.,.,.:.,,;:.,.,,:,.,..,,:,........:..,.:: | 08/07/12 | | texasLawlz (no longer a member of t14) | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | texasLawlz (no longer a member of t14) | 08/07/12 | | .,.,,..,..,.,.,:,,:,...,:::.,...,:,.,.:...:.,,.::, | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | OSIRIS | 08/07/12 | | sensitive perverted niggas that dont like drums. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | OSIRIS | 08/07/12 | | .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,.,,,:::,.;,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,.,,,:::,.;,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,. | 08/07/12 | | .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.. | 08/07/12 | | ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,.. | 08/07/12 | | CarneyLansford | 08/07/12 | | Talib Kweli | 08/07/12 | | OSIRIS | 08/07/12 | | .,,..,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.,:, | 08/07/12 | | homeless | 08/07/12 | | flyfisher110 | 08/07/12 | | ... ,. .,. ... ... ...... | 08/07/12 | | jack24 | 08/07/12 | | Noobling | 08/07/12 | | jack24 | 08/07/12 |
Poast new message in this thread
Date: August 7th, 2012 9:06 AM Author: ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,.........,
In country after country, increased government spending acted more like a depressant than a stimulant.
By ARTHUR B. LAFFER
http://online.wsj.com/article_email/SB10000872396390444873204577537244225685010-lMyQjAxMTAyMDAwNjAwODY3Wj.html?mod=wsj_valetleft_email
Policy makers in Washington and other capitals around the world are debating whether to implement another round of stimulus spending to combat high unemployment and sputtering growth rates. But before they leap, they should take a good hard look at how that worked the first time around.
It worked miserably, as indicated by the table nearby, which shows increases in government spending from 2007 to 2009 and subsequent changes in GDP growth rates. Of the 34 Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development nations, those with the largest spending spurts from 2007 to 2009 saw the least growth in GDP rates before and after the stimulus.
The four nations—Estonia, Ireland, the Slovak Republic and Finland—with the biggest stimulus programs had the steepest declines in growth. The United States was no different, with greater spending (up 7.3%) followed by far lower growth rates (down 8.4%).
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Still, the debate rages between those who espouse stimulus spending as a remedy for our weak economy and those who argue it is the cause of our current malaise. The numbers at stake aren't small. Federal government spending as a share of GDP rose to a high of 27.3% in 2009 from 21.4% in late 2007. This increase is virtually all stimulus spending, including add-ons to the agricultural and housing bills in 2007, the $600 per capita tax rebate in 2008, the TARP and Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bailouts, "cash for clunkers," additional mortgage relief subsidies and, of course, President Obama's $860 billion stimulus plan that promised to deliver unemployment rates below 6% by now. Stimulus spending over the past five years totaled more than $4 trillion.
If you believe, as I do, that the macro economy is the sum total of all of its micro parts, then stimulus spending really doesn't make much sense. In essence, it's when government takes additional resources beyond what it would otherwise take from one group of people (usually the people who produced the resources) and then gives those resources to another group of people (often to non-workers and non-producers).
Often as not, the qualification for receiving stimulus funds is the absence of work or income—such as banks and companies that fail, solar energy companies that can't make it on their own, unemployment benefits and the like. Quite simply, government taxing people more who work and then giving more money to people who don't work is a surefire recipe for less work, less output and more unemployment.
Yet the notion that additional spending is a "stimulus" and less spending is "austerity" is the norm just about everywhere. Without ever thinking where the money comes from, politicians and many economists believe additional government spending adds to aggregate demand. You'd think that single-entry accounting were the God's truth and that, for the government at least, every check written has no offsetting debit.
Well, the truth is that government spending does come with debits. For every additional government dollar spent there is an additional private dollar taken. All the stimulus to the spending recipients is matched on a dollar-for-dollar basis every minute of every day by a depressant placed on the people who pay for these transfers. Or as a student of the dismal science might say, the total income effects of additional government spending always sum to zero.
Meanwhile, what economists call the substitution or price effects of stimulus spending are negative for all parties. In other words, the transfer recipient has found a way to get paid without working, which makes not working more attractive, and the transfer payer gets paid less for working, again lowering incentives to work.
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Getty Images
But all of this is just old-timey price theory, the stuff that used to be taught in graduate economics departments. Today, even stimulus spending advocates have their Ph.D. defenders. But there's no arguing with the data in the nearby table, and the fact that greater stimulus spending was followed by lower growth rates. Stimulus advocates have a lot of explaining to do. Their massive spending programs have hurt the economy and left us with huge bills to pay. Not a very nice combination.
Sorry, Keynesians. There was no discernible two or three dollar multiplier effect from every dollar the government spent and borrowed. In reality, every dollar of public-sector spending on stimulus simply wiped out a dollar of private investment and output, resulting in an overall decline in GDP. This is an even more astonishing result because government spending is counted in official GDP numbers. In other words, the spending was more like a valium for lethargic economies than a stimulant.
In many countries, an economic downturn, no matter how it's caused or the degree of change in the rate of growth, will trigger increases in public spending and therefore the appearance of a negative relationship between stimulus spending and economic growth. That is why the table focuses on changes in the rate of GDP growth, which helps isolate the effects of additional spending.
The evidence here is extremely damaging to the case made by Mr. Obama and others that there is economic value to spending more money on infrastructure, education, unemployment insurance, food stamps, windmills and bailouts. Mr. Obama keeps saying that if only Congress would pass his second stimulus plan, unemployment would finally start to fall. That's an expensive leap of faith with no evidence to confirm it.
Mr. Laffer, chairman of Laffer Associates and the Laffer Center for Supply-Side Economics, is co-author, with Stephen Moore, of "Return to Prosperity: How America Can Regain Its Economic Superpower Status" (Threshold, 2010).
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278844) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:14 AM Author: ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,.........,
Whoa. U mad?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278875) |

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:12 AM Author: .,,..,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.,:, (Boomer Culture must die)
Lol just lol @ Laffer have any cred at all
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278864) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:15 AM Author: ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,.........,
Why doesn't he?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278878) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:19 AM Author: ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,.........,
The op-ed seems ok.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278903) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:16 AM Author: .,,..,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.,:, (Boomer Culture must die)
All of his major work was revealed to be epic flame
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278885) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:19 AM Author: ...,,.,..,,..........,,,.,.,....,,....,.........,
Link?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278901) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:35 AM Author: .,.,,..,,.,.,.:.,,;:.,.,,:,.,..,,:,........:..,.::
for one thing he interpolates concave parabolas whenever he sees two points on a graph...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/70/Neo-Laffer_curve.svg/600px-Neo-Laffer_curve.svg.png
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278955) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:34 AM Author: .,.,,..,,.,.,.:.,,;:.,.,,:,.,..,,:,........:..,.::
this
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278952) |

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:28 AM Author: .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,.,,,:::,.;,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,.
this op-ed is completely laughable. he's only looking at 2006-2007 to 2008-2009 and comes to the sweeping generalization that stimulus doesn't work. his data has zero credibility: http://uneasymoney.com/2012/08/06/arthur-laffer-anti-enlightenment-economist/
this is complete and utter garbage.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278932) |

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:36 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
You mean a prominent economist supported his position by using manipulated data?? Wow, I guess I've seen it all now.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278958) |

Date: August 7th, 2012 9:38 AM Author: .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,.
The wsj is getting to be bad as fox news
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278962) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:39 AM Author: .,.,,..,,.,.,.:.,,;:.,.,,:,.,..,,:,........:..,.::
b-b-but MICHAEL JORDAN!
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303649504577492300632472284.html
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278969) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:41 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
This is in the editorial section breh, not News. Maybe you should peruse the absolute shit they print in the Times editorial section before you say that. (That's right I'm looking at YOU Paul Krugman)
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278977) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:42 AM Author: .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,.
Krugman has 10000 times more credibility than this hack
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278982) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:43 AM Author: .,.,,..,..,.,.,:,,:,...,:::.,...,:,.,.:...:.,,.::,
^^shitlib
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278987) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:44 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
JUST FUCKING LOL AT KRUGMAN FANBOIS.
Guy passes of political commentary as economic theory and then hides behind the "credibility" of his Nobel prize when actually challenged on the data he uses to support his hack opinions.
HTH
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278993) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:46 AM Author: .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,.
Krugman is very hyperbolic and say some silly things, but his data is always real. That is what separates him from people like lolaffer.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278997) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:48 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
Seriously you've shown you have no objectivity with this comment. You basically admit that he lies and says thing that may not be true, but that's okay because he supports policies you agree with. And I'm not defending Laffer, but if you can't see that they are both cut from the same cloth, GOD FUCKING HELP YOU.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279005) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:48 AM Author: .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,.
I don't think he lies, that is not what hyperbolic means.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279009) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:51 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
Hyperbole implies a certain degree of dishonesty. If I say I EXAGGERATE the facts, does that mean that I am telling the truth??
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279018) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:53 AM Author: .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,.
It depends, I think he tells the truth. He just uses extreme rhetoric.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279022) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:54 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
Yes of course, it depends. If you happen to agree with his point it's not lying.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279029) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 10:16 AM Author: .,.,....,.,.,.,:,,:,...,:.;.....,:,.,..,..,:.::,.
if he believes the points the is making his not lying, is he
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279128) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:49 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
If you notice, I'm not actually supporting Laffer (he is a moron). But both him and Krugman attempt to disguise what are really political opinions as economic policy.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279011) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:57 AM Author: .,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,..
it only seems the same thing, but Krugman's political opinions have the data on their side.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279044) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:46 AM Author: .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,.,,,:::,.;,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,.
Krugman destroys austerians on the reg. He's a one-man wrecking crew. His columns are awesome.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279001) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:48 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
LOL at destroying. He's been exposed as a prolific cherry picker of data to support his theories.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279008) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:55 AM Author: .,.,...,..,.,.,:,,:,.,,,:::,.;,.,:,.,.:.:.,:.::,.
No he has not. He's usually the one exposing austerian and trickle-down hacks.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279032) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:59 AM Author: ,.,,,;,..,;,;,.,.,;:.;:;:,..,...,:,.,;::,;...,..
ROFL, tyty.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279053) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 9:40 AM Author: .,,..,..,.,..:,,:,...,:::,.,.,:,.,.:.,:.,:.,:, (Boomer Culture must die)
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21278976) |

Date: August 7th, 2012 10:02 AM Author: homeless
Things debunked ages ago:
1) communism
2) psychics
3) the laffer curve. (I mean, seriously?)
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21279059) |
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Date: August 7th, 2012 1:24 PM Author: jack24
I agree, if you mean that there is disagreement about where on the curve tax rates start to inhibit growth or revenue.
I also think the Laffer type analysis is much different if you are dealing with capital gains taxes as opposed to income taxes.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2017037&forum_id=2#21280179) |
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