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Ran into dude from my high school who "day trades"
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:34 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus Lives in the burbs with a roommate. Seems super relaxed. Says he tries to make $100 a day. Can't tell whether he is winning at life or not. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28367992) |
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Date: August 13th, 2015 6:50 PM Author: Khaki Razzle Theater Stage I tried this and FAILED (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28545266) |
Date: July 19th, 2015 8:38 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car $100 a day is awful for a day trader. He might as well do something else. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368017) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:39 PM Author: salmon tanning salon if he can pull off $100 consistently, he can pull off $1000 |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:40 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car Correct. His account size is probably very small....like $8000 or something. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368032) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:41 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus I assume it's like an average. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368043) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:40 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus Didn't get the sense he's great at it. Just trying to keep his head above water. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368034) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:41 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car Day trading is too hard for those with small accounts. Not recommended unless you have at least $100k to trade with. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368044) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:50 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus Lol doubt he has 50k (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368104) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:51 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car If he's only making $100 a day, he probably has a $10k account or something. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368115) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:52 PM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn What average daily income could someone day trading fulltime with 100-150k expect to make (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368125) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:53 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car It really depends on how much time they're putting into research/analysis, how many good picks they can identify each day, if they have proper money management, etc.
I know of a guy who started with a $130k account and ended the year with around $850k, but he's really talented and traded often. I don't know what the average is. My guess would be $100-175k a year for someone trading on a $100-150k account full time while using proper money management techniques. Of course, this assumes they know what they're doing and have at least a 50% success rate. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:33 PM Author: obsidian adulterous mad cow disease elastic band lol at the word "talent" being used here (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368943) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:40 PM Author: concupiscible principal's office (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29167267) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:47 PM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn So I can literally double my money in a year? Lol why the fuck doesn't everyone do this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369077) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:49 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car Yes, you can, but it's not as easy as just throwing some money in a few random stocks everyday and profiting. It takes a lot of research, looking at/analyzing charts, measuring risk vs reward, understanding support and resistance, being disciplined enough to not deviate from your investment plan, etc....easier said than done.
Most bros end up losing money for one reason or another. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 9:49 AM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn Id spend 50 hrs a week doing this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371061) |
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Date: August 13th, 2015 3:44 PM Author: up-to-no-good keepsake machete nursing home guy who believes in fairy tales (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28544008) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:17 AM Author: Tripping coffee pot what sort of 'research' does it take?
why aren't far bigger players with far more resources doing that research better and capitalizing on those opportunities better than the daytraders? |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:52 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set it's pure gambling with no edge (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369135) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:54 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car gambling? lol no.
if that were the case, there wouldn't be bros out here who are consistently profitable year in and year out. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:56 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set actually, there would be. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369177) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:57 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car Trust me, it's not gambling. It really does take knowledge , skill, and discipline to become consistently profitable. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369186) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 11:03 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set Ok I believe it now. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369229) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:51 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop No it's not. It's (1) measuring trend lines and basic patterns and retracements and (2) being disciplined enough to not get greedy (pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered). The market is fear and greed and its general movements are fairly predictable. If you try to predict its exact movements, however, you will get burnt. Good day traders (and swing traders) therefore take their small profit and get out of the position before it turns, then repeat that sort of trade many many times. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371355) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:03 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat Both 1 and 2 are done more accurately and better by machines. Even if technical trading worked, they would destroy you at it and pay less in fees. Why would some guy in his underwear be able to compete?
The only "good" day trading strategy for the amateur is market manipulation (illegal but hard to get caught if you trade in another country or whatever) like flashing orders in the market to trick algos, gunning the price on illiquid stocks to make others buy back from you, squeezes, stop running, shit like that. Chinese do it all the time. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:09 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop Retracements and patterns do exist and it's easy for a small trader with a hundred thousand or so to ride them in a big stock like Apple. 99% of day traders are using technical analysis. Automated trading and the like does not eliminate patterns. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371478) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:17 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat Ok so every quant geek on the street has the same data being fed into machine learning algos yet these persistent patterns exist and nobody knows to trade them but weird dudes on internet forums?
Every good day trader in the late 90s/early 2000s was reading the Level II/tape. I don't know anyone who made money with technicals. Of course now machines are way way better at reading Level II than any human could ever hope to be. Day trading, at least in US stocks, is 100% dead for the small guy.
Prove me wrong. Start posting your entry points in AAPL along with where you'd exit for a winner/loss every time you see a "trend" breaking out and we'll see how good you are. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:15 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop High speed trading is done better by computers, but not technical trading which takes the ability to identify what the herd is going to do. I.e. Is the short 30 minute trend more compelling than the weaker 30 day trend line that you are approaching, etc. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371514) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:18 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat Yes computers are very, very bad at computing moving averages over different time scales. If trading like this worked, it would be so easy to automate. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371533) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:32 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop Day trading is about figuring out what other humans will do, not computers. Humans are better at this. Humans aren't rational. Sometimes the crowd will follow a Fibonacci regression, sometimes it will defer to the candlestick pattern (head and shoulders, bear flag, etc, etc). A human is better situated to see which of multiple simultaneous signals is most compelling than a computer is. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371612) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 1:06 PM Author: Twisted toilet seat lolno (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28372150) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:37 AM Author: lascivious crystalline weed whacker Best hedge fund managers in the world: ECSTATIC with 20% returns
Day traders: routinely doubling their money year after year |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:44 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat HF managers have too much money so they can't scale. Their sheer size moves the market against them and diminishes their edge.
It is definitely possible to have an insane sharpe day-trading, but the people doing it aren't sitting in their bedroom eating cheetos. They're working for quant hedge funds or legit prop trading groups. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:50 AM Author: lascivious crystalline weed whacker This is idiotic. You could manage hundreds of millions of dollars without moving the market in large stocks. And if you're dealing with thinly traded ones, then you're gonna move the market with thousands of dollars. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371350) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:58 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat Flame? A mega cap stock like GE trades about $1bn/day. You think you can do 10-20% of the market volume without pushing the price against you? How would that work? Computers can detect this so easily now even if you just trade a few clips. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371406) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:05 AM Author: puce razzle-dazzle menage factory reset button You don't size up a position in one day
A $5B fund putting on a 10% position is $500M. At 10% of volume (about what my fund does normally) it takes 5 days to finish for something like GE
But your investable universe certainly shrinks as your AUM grows. It's just not efficient for analysts to be looking at $300M market cap companies when that's going to be like .2% of the fund
It is tougher to outperform as you scale. At some point it becomes an AUM gathering game vs an outperformance game. You want to stay close to market performance while gathering a bunch of assets and live off that 2%.
The rationale is during a downturn you should significantly outperform given short exposure.
This is why you always see spin outs in HFs. The PMs/founders just want to aggregate assets while the hungry junior guys without points in the GP want to outperform |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:11 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat Yes and how much implementation shortfall do you have on a trade that big? If your fund was tiny, you could do a lot of those trades for really small size on leverage, face little/no market impact, and your annual return/sharpe would be huge. That's basically what RenTec does.
Maybe the investable universe thing is a bigger issue. It is probably tougher to find alpha in a stable blue chip company than one with more volatility. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:12 AM Author: puce razzle-dazzle menage factory reset button Yes algo shops are a completely different beast
And yes as a normal equity l/s it is tougher to generate alpha the bigger you get |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:41 AM Author: lascivious crystalline weed whacker this is clearly true but does not mean that people can consistently and repeatable double their money every year day trading. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371668) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 12:09 PM Author: puce razzle-dazzle menage factory reset button I didnt argue that. Day trading is gambling against a significant house edge
For every large hedge fund that can't invest ina position given liquidity constraints there are a host of smaller funds or algo shops that can |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:41 PM Author: Brass Aromatic Organic Girlfriend Resort Since the market has gone consistently up over the last several years, this is fine. But in a sideways market, he is going to lose money. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368046) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:42 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car In a sideways market, you don't trade at all. I think that's why many traders lose money...they try trading when nothing is there. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368053) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:52 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop In a sideways market day traders can still make plenary of money. Stocks still go up and down in predictable patterns. Profits may be smaller, be sure. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371367) |
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Date: August 13th, 2015 3:45 PM Author: up-to-no-good keepsake machete nursing home guy who is great at roulette (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28544024) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:42 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus I think he is just trading volatility, don't think it matters which way the market goes. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368056) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:43 PM Author: salmon tanning salon dude can easily scale up then... just trading probabilities (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368061) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:42 PM Author: Sick comical black woman he would be better off going to a poker room and buy in for 300 in a 1-3NL game and just wait for AA/KK/QQ and play super tight
easy 100~150 dollars a day if you are willing to sit for 5-6 hrs |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:45 PM Author: cyan mildly autistic travel guidebook (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368078) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:50 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus Sounds awful (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368114) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:34 PM Author: obsidian adulterous mad cow disease elastic band this is why I can't play poker. too much sitting around doing nothing. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368949) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:05 AM Author: diverse rough-skinned deer antler shrine it's actually not bad. most professional grinders do other shit like read books, listen to music/podcasts, etc. while playing.
but they don't play $300 games. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:44 PM Author: cyan mildly autistic travel guidebook Usually code for trust fund kid too embarrassed to say he doesn't have a job (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368067) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:45 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car If so, he's winning at life. No one really enjoys working. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368073) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 8:52 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus Maybe but he moved to the burbs w a roommate to save money (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368122) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:24 PM Author: chrome national He could be building his bankroll or just BS'ing
If your working with smaller amounts of money it takes time to build up to the point where you can make solid, decent income off of each idea you have.
If your swing trading or going for a few high conviction names and riding them out for a long time - having 10k~20k per idea that you are comfortable with can really lead to something. Assuming you can make 50% profit over a year or two per name, you can do well for a few years and then reposition yourself when you have a good sized portfolio
It's slow going in the begining but you have to have the discipline and you need that time to get comfortable and learn as you go because you could really fuck around and wipe out your capital just when you need it.
I'd say having around 75K+ can allow you to make some decent sized wagers, but you need another side hustle or a job at least in the begining (preferably the whole time) because the stress of NEEDING a trade is what can get someone broke. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:26 PM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn Can you recommend a book for beginners? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368878) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:31 PM Author: chrome national Just the usual Ben Graham reading, and then move into a few other value guys like Klarman. Another good one is Common Stocks; Uncommon Profits by Phil Fisher.
So much of successful investing is trial and error, observation, practice but those books really help you get to an understanding of what to look for.
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:32 PM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn tyvm (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368934) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:35 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus He said he's been doing it full time for three years now. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28368957) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:43 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car Just live at home with mom instead while building up trading portfolio lol
As you said, bros tend to trade better when they don't have to make a certain amount everyday just to pay bills and stay afloat. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:48 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=2925849&mc=68&forum_id=2
reminder two weeks ago this clown was warning of imminent market collapse. professional traders are the biggest frauds on the planet. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 11:25 PM Author: gay theatre (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369442) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:45 AM Author: cerebral violent blood rage corner (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371321) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 1:58 PM Author: chrome national what now NIGGA??? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28597425) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 2:57 PM Author: chrome national Plz respond (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28597912) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 7:55 PM Author: chrome national (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599686) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 9:16 AM Author: metal motley church building 1 billion (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602103) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 12:45 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set Oh no 6%. Bump when the market actually moves. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602938) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 11:10 AM Author: chrome national Ur done here buddy (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28614686) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 11:14 AM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set Markets go up and down. Please awe us with more vague useless predictions. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28614706) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 11:59 AM Author: Vivacious nowag point PWN PWN PWN (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28614882) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 12:07 PM Author: salmon tanning salon 1000 pt 1 day swing. this ain't over |
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Date: December 29th, 2015 5:34 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set ? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29478932) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 7:00 PM Author: salmon tanning salon DOW moved more today than anytime in HISTORY
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-08-24/dow-just-did-largest-roundtrip-rollercoaster-ever
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Date: August 24th, 2015 7:01 PM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28617285) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 7:01 PM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28617286) |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 7:20 PM Author: salmon tanning salon more than 2008 financial meltdown (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28617372) |
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Date: August 25th, 2015 3:16 AM Author: salmon tanning salon Another day (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28620227) |
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Date: August 30th, 2015 4:06 PM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28655673) |
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Date: August 30th, 2015 7:35 PM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28656781) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 8:35 PM Author: salmon tanning salon Oh Where oh where has my little PUMO gone, Oh Where Oh Where can he Be?? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599888) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 8:42 PM Author: chrome national (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599929) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 10:48 AM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn I believe he is now done here (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602369) |
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Date: December 29th, 2015 5:50 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set Where did you go?
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Date: August 21st, 2015 8:39 PM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599915) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 8:39 PM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599916) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 10:42 AM Author: salmon tanning salon (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602345) |
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Date: September 4th, 2015 12:33 PM Author: salmon tanning salon here it comes.. phase 2 capitulation (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28688145) |
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Date: September 28th, 2015 7:33 PM Author: salmon tanning salon
WAZZUP... |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:51 PM Author: Greedy Floppy Hell You seem to know a lot about day trading. I'm assuming you did it before? What was your experience like and what do you do now? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369125) |
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Date: August 13th, 2015 3:47 PM Author: up-to-no-good keepsake machete nursing home and if you were so good at it, why aren't you doing it now? |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:39 PM Author: buff temple LOL at the day trading flame being perpetrated on this board.
Unless you work for a hedge fund, your money should be in an index fund.
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:42 PM Author: magenta chest-beating spot roommate (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369024) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:44 PM Author: razzmatazz laser beams locus I don't have any stake here. The guy seemed a bit like a stoner and didn't exactly seem to be crushing it. But I do believe he is at least supporting himself with this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369038) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:45 PM Author: Appetizing ticket booth stock car lol no
What you're saying only holds true if one doesn't really know what they're doing. However, I assume that someone doing this full time isn't clueless and is confident they can profit consistently.
You don't need to work at a hedge fund to consistently profit from the stock market. The only reason people work at hedge funds instead of just investing on their own is because they don't risk any of their own capital when they just have a job somewhere. |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:50 PM Author: Hairraiser gay wizard set the reason people work at hedge funds is that it allows them to skim large amounts of money from rich people while providing no benefits whatsoever (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369113) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:54 PM Author: buff temple Most people who daytrade are textbook Dunning-Kruger. This whole "get a book off Amazon.com and daytrade, bro!" schtick is absurd. Efficient Market Hypothesis, motherfucker.
People who work at hedge funds like RenTech are actually able to beat the market. |
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Date: August 30th, 2015 4:38 PM Author: bearded marketing idea address EMH is bullshit but so is day trading. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28655808) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:55 AM Author: puce razzle-dazzle menage factory reset button We have such a gigantic information advantage over your normal day trader that it's like a guy at the blackjack table counting cards/following the hit/stand rules 100% vs a guy generally not following the rules and doing shit like hitting on 17
Sure that guy might make money and might even randomly outperform but it's blind luck
We have access to management teams. We can call customers. We can call suppliers. We can call experts. We can have people sitting in fucking parking lots counting trucks that leave / arrive.
A day trader? Some seeking alpha articles and yahoo finance message boards? |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:13 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop The day trader has the charts to analyze. Stocks don't just blow through 6 month trend lines without bumping, etc. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371500) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 2:04 PM Author: Stirring aggressive prole Jesus mother of xo 2015 fuck. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28597467) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 9:17 AM Author: metal motley church building good luck out there hoss (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602104) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 12:07 PM Author: canary disrespectful lettuce i once downloaded a PDF of some technical analysis aka DAYTRADE book, and it was ASTROLOGY-tier levels of fallacy
OH THIS STOCK IS CRASHING FASTER THAN USUAL, ITS NOT FOLLOWING THE TRIANGLE RULE, BETTER BUY NOW!
*place your money in stock X* *stock crashes* *you lose half your money* *you hold out because the book said 'its just market noise bro' |
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Date: August 24th, 2015 12:06 PM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28614911) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:21 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat Yeah HFs have information/analytics advantage. Algo traders have a speed/fee/sometimes quant advantage. The day trader at home has ???
These day trader posts are about as dumb as people claiming they could hit an MLB fastball. |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:37 AM Author: Tripping coffee pot "We can call customers. We can call suppliers. We can call experts."
why do they talk to you? do you make those calls yourself? I mean, a day trader could look up a bunch of people that strike them as relevant and start cold calling, no? (obviously the management teams would be tougher) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:46 PM Author: Territorial zippy whorehouse azn (graduate student) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369061) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:52 PM Author: buff temple If you have the time, this paper provides a nuanced take on the "Can you beat the market?" question:
http://faculty.chicagobooth.edu/john.cochrane/research/papers/size_of_finance.pdf |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:22 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371557) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:48 PM Author: excitant home depressive What a stupid fuck. He should be buying n64 games and stockpiling them (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369085) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:48 PM Author: autistic hospital haunted graveyard (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28369096) |
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Date: August 25th, 2015 3:23 AM Author: Smoky aphrodisiac base (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28620238) |
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Date: July 19th, 2015 10:53 PM Author: disturbing space partner if it's $100 net of all expenses and taxes, that's a lot different than "making $100" on a trade, then subtracting out the $14 for the fidelity buy & sell and the short term capital gains tax and state tax, leaving him with like $50
either way, good for this dood if he can actually live that way but odds are way against him over time |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:40 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat That's why this flame is tough to believe. Let's say he bets $10k on each trade and pays $28 in fees per buy/sell (0.28%), average stock price is like $50 so he pays 0.01 spread to buy and sell for 200 shares = 50*0.01*200*2 = $4 = 0.04%.
If the market is totally unpredictable, his EV is ~0.9968 * $ bet, meaning he'll slowly lose money to fees and spread over a long enough time scale. To get to break even, he needs an edge of almost 0.5%. Is that impossible to do, no, but on an intra-day timescale you are competing with people who are much faster and smarter who don't start every trade 0.5% in the hole.
Also with so little capital, a run of bad luck can ruin this guy easily even if he has an edge. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:58 AM Author: Provocative lay knife the robinhood app offers free trades (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371410) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:07 AM Author: Twisted toilet seat And how do they do that? By selling order flow to market makers. Those market makers want order flow that isn't informed about where the price is going, otherwise how would they make money? If a Robinhood client is constantly doing winning day trades, they'll probably be sent away.
Also even trading for free is worse than what the pros get. Big banks, HFs, market makers are paid rebates to trade and can make the bid-ask spread. |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:10 AM Author: puce razzle-dazzle menage factory reset button Robin Hood's model has been tried before and failed. Just because it's now a mobile app vs a desktop web page doesn't mean it's not unsustainable
When they are operating deep in the red and the VC money runs out, they'll sell just for the accounts or change their biz model |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:02 AM Author: diverse rough-skinned deer antler shrine day trading is literal gambling. might as well play online blackjack. wait it's actually possible to capture a small edge there. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371091) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:55 AM Author: Rebellious gaming laptop Thank you for perpetrating the myth that allows day traders to stay in business. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371384) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:19 AM Author: orange crackhouse scourge upon the earth *10 percent of day traders (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371541) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 10:46 AM Author: learning disabled stage potus (Mohammed Islam of Stuyvesant) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371324) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 11:13 AM Author: Cobalt Becky Orchestra Pit Day trading on a small account is impossibly hard. You could trade futures contracts but you'd be scared shitless to lose your account if down by a few points (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371499) |
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Date: July 20th, 2015 12:12 PM Author: yellow spectacular trump supporter macaca I've traded actively for about 7 years. Former lawyer. No hedge fund maestro, but I'll try to answer a few questions if people have them. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28371821) |
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Date: August 13th, 2015 3:31 PM Author: Bateful mad-dog skullcap thoughts on this thread? http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=2962248&mc=19&forum_id=2 |
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Date: August 13th, 2015 6:53 PM Author: Khaki Razzle Theater Stage People still daytrade? Really? I honestly thought that high-frequency trading did away with all the daytrading. How is there enough spread to make a profit? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28545278) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 7:48 PM Author: Stirring aggressive prole shockingly day trading picks up steam whenever markets are hot. in other news, isn't etrade crazy? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599656) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 8:13 PM Author: Khaki Razzle Theater Stage Do people just buy and hold a few days or however long until they can sell at a profit? That's not really day trading, that's swing trading. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599771) |
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Date: August 21st, 2015 8:20 PM Author: wonderful ungodly mexican It's like they have no idea that the real easy money is in flipping houses. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28599813) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 7:57 AM Author: Vivacious nowag point comments like the one that you just made show that you don't understand what day trading is it what high frequency trading is. Millions of people day trade as a profession. Do you really think they are all wasting their time? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602024) |
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Date: August 22nd, 2015 10:57 AM Author: swashbuckling pozpig I just blew my account with another stock trading strategy, and I'm pretty smart. I don't think it's doable. So depressed today, but the good news is the loss offsets my ordinary income so I'll get like half of it back. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28602413) |
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Date: August 25th, 2015 3:23 AM Author: Smoky aphrodisiac base shit, should prob. make this it's ow subthread.
honestly, i don't see how someone can play the stock market with a small bankroll and "win" consistently enough to live on. (niche) collectibles seem a lot easier, because price discovery is SO much slower with less participants/buyers in the respective markets.
you can be a big fish. |
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Date: August 25th, 2015 8:25 AM Author: passionate international law enforcement agency I made just under 40k from 10k in a year trading in college. All foreign stocks though, basically just need to be able to weed out the chinese frauds from legit companies. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28620476) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:13 AM Author: Elite jet-lagged state (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29166417) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 12:58 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29167053) |
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Date: August 25th, 2015 10:25 AM Author: nudist cracking market considering it's nearly impossible to consistently beat the market over time, what makes this shit for brains think he can day trade with his $10k account and make a living? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28620833) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:24 AM Author: irradiated son of senegal (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29166480) |
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Date: August 25th, 2015 2:39 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state Momentum trading seems easy with the right software
Mystery Man Moving Japan Made More Than 1 Million Trades http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-09-25/mystery-man-moving-japan-made-more-than-1-million-trades |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:11 AM Author: Elite jet-lagged state (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29166403) |
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Date: September 28th, 2015 7:38 PM Author: Khaki Razzle Theater Stage Guys in my high school made fortunes off day trading all the time, it was no big deal. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#28856699) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:20 AM Author: Flesh Trip Messiness Lodge I can't believe the number of idiots in this thread defending this shit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29166455) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:25 AM Author: Elite jet-lagged state rate my strategy that I've made about 50% on in the past two weeks:
Watch a list of the top ten gainers for the day. There is always a huge run by at least a few of them for about 8-30% from 9:30-Noon on any given day. When you see one running up, go in, set a stop loss, and make a few percent, then get out. Repeat if you need to, but making 5% a day is good.
I don't even have the correct software yet, but I am buying it and planning to watch buy and sell orders. When sell or buy orders overwhelm the other, that means one is in control of the stock for those few moments, causing stock to dive or spike. |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 11:46 AM Author: Bateful mad-dog skullcap i brought up doing something like this a couple months ago, everyone here shit on me: http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=2962248&mc=19&forum_id=2
keep us poasted on how it goes. im interested. |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 12:15 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state How'd it go for you bro? Did you keep trading? I've never lost for 2 weeks now. 5% average everyday (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29166823) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:30 PM Author: Bateful mad-dog skullcap i never tried it im just long w 4-5 high yield tech stocks |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:35 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state i mean, you might outperform the index, but fuck bro you can make a ton of $$ day trading. i am quitting my job for this shit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29167237) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:36 PM Author: Bateful mad-dog skullcap what software/website do you use? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29167246) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:38 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state Just started using interactive brokers. Dont have any software yet lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29167254) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:42 PM Author: Bateful mad-dog skullcap this website posts tops gainers and losers pretty early in the day with their volume my idea was logging in right as the market opens, see who's gaining the most, watch for high volume, buy that stock, then sell after a gain in the afternoon, wash rinse repeat with other stocks the next day etc. after so many days of doing this, you would slowly start to make $$$ xo was saying it was stupid bc trading fees/taxes would eat everything and that i'd have to trade on margin, so i didnt end up doing it |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:46 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state Doesn't look they stay updated in real time? I am looking into software that shows buy and sell orders in real time. i think interactive brokers does this but i'm just learning it.
That sounds risky to me, volume doesn't necessary mean the stock is going up. I use volume to weed out the stocks I'm not interested in. Only stock above 250,000 are the ones I will consider, need to be able to dump the stock fast. |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 1:47 PM Author: Bateful mad-dog skullcap no idea (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29167313) |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 2:30 PM Author: Pontificating legal warrant cruise ship You need to backtest this. Lots of stocks after good after hours news (like earnings) will gap up on open, but then will give up some of those gains as the gap fills. There is a lot that goes into analyzing whether a morning bounce is going to retreat or whether you can momentum trade it.
I've personally been getting into options trading, and more specifically being a net SELLER of options. This is a good way to consistently make money because over time, the deck is stacked in favor of sellers.
About a month in, I'm down moderately. Most of that is due to legit bad luck on two trades . . . I expect trades like that from time to time but getting two with the amount of trading I'm done was statistically unlikely. Even with those two trades, I'd be up slightly had I not mismanaged some other trades, but I've already learned a shitload and won't make those same mistakes again (not hindsight bias mistakes but rather legit fundamental errors).
For example, the one trade where I bought instead of sold options actually went very well because I bought Chevron calls and the stock skyrocketed, leaving me up over 200% in a short time. I knew I needed to lock those gains in because oil has been range bound and the stock was likely to pull back, but I tried to sell the options for the middle of the bid-ask spread, not paying attention to the fact that they had low volume and weren't very liquid anymore due to being so deep in the money. The stock had a huge pullback as predicted, and I lost a 200% gain trying to avoid taking a 5% hit on the spread.
The above was definitely the most speculative trade that I've done, and I did it mainly because I planned to potentially exercise the option to rebalance stock holdings.
My normal trades usually involve selling bull put spreads, selling iron condors, and selling covered calls. The simple covered call is probably the best way to make money but also needs the most capital (another alternative is selling cash secured puts on stock you'd like to buy on a dip, but again that needs a lot of capital).
I think anyone smart can make consistent money trading options as long as they stick to the lower risk plays and act as a net seller of options. There is a large learning curve but options can be analyzed in a legitimate, statistical way, as opposed do day trading where you look at candles and trendlines and go with your gut. |
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Date: November 12th, 2015 3:34 PM Author: Elite jet-lagged state Do you do this full time?
In my experience the jump shortly after opening is usually pretty substantial, like 15% after already having a huge gain on opening. It's not too hard to spot a stock in this area that has high volume and is making moves, quickly jump in and out and make 3%. I don't even have the software yet to look at candles and buy and sell orders. But when sell or buy orders overwhelm the market, it seems like it would be a good idea to jump in, because sellers or buyers will control that market. When I get that I think I can make even more money.
I also put in a stop-loss so if the trade fucks up I won't lose much at all. This has only happened to me once, and I immediately found another stock and covered for it x5.
Sounds like you know what you're doing with the options trading. |
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Date: December 29th, 2015 7:31 PM Author: Khaki Razzle Theater Stage This thread is so exciting, it's causing me to jizz uncontrollably. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2940220&forum_id=2#29479850) |