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Have to fire someone next week. Am dreading it.
Poast new message in this thread
Date: September 20th, 2016 12:30 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location She is a bad lawyer with terrible hours who adds very little to our firm, but it is still almost all I can think about. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451396) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:40 PM Author: comical school They'll be better off! Just tell the person to work for his or her self (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451473) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:40 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location she tried that at some point before she came to us. I don't think it went well. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451481) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:44 PM Author: comical school It's a girl is she fuckable? If she does things right give her a chance to save her job friend;) or find her something else;) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451504) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:45 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location no, not at all (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451510) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:49 PM Author: Offensive Athletic Conference ugly and bad at her job?
DING! |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 7:21 PM Author: smoky talented son of senegal (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31454084) |
Date: September 20th, 2016 12:30 PM Author: floppy crawly chapel codepig You're a decent human being, congrats (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451405) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:02 PM Author: Sadistic Theatre (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451636) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:31 PM Author: pea-brained headpube just be happy it isn't reversed (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451409) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:32 PM Author: Odious really tough guy "with terrible hours"
LOL @ this "profession" |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:32 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location Especially once you include her share of fixed costs, we are losing a good bit of money by employing her.
And her hours are shit because no one wants to work with her, not because there isn't enough work to do. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:37 PM Author: Odious really tough guy why doesnt anyone want to work with her (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451452) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:39 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location see below. Just not a good lawyer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451466) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:34 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station what makes her a bad lawyer and how long has she been with teh firm? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451434) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:37 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location A year. Has billed 750 hours. Makes mistakes, so you have to check everything she does. Doesn't have any intuitive sense of the right thing to do and clearly doesn't often even understand what is going on. If she were enthusiastic or responsive or any of those things that are intangible, we might be willing to work with her, but doesn't really seem to care much or have a particularly good attitude about anything. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451455) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:39 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station she has to know the ax is coming after performance reviews and billing 750, no? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451467) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:40 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location yes, probably, although I insinuated a month or so ago that we might instead move her to hourly, although now we've decided we just need to cut the cord. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451476) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:47 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station btw, how glaring are her mistakes? i kind of do this too but never anything substantive (i think). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451521) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:49 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location pretty glaring. Gave her about 15 tenant estoppels to prepare for a real estate acquisition, and there are at least 5 mistakes that would be a major issue if they ever actually came up after closing. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451532) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:50 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station T25 LS? If not, this is what your firm gets for hiring 40 yr old TTT grads. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451545) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:56 PM Author: Beta therapy what's a "T25" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451590) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:59 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station top 25 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451617) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:37 PM Author: out-of-control dilemma how are you gonna do it? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451451) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:38 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location Walk into her office, shut the door, and tell her we are letting her go. She has gotten a lot of talking to over the last couple of months, so it certainly won't come as a complete shock. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451463) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:32 PM Author: hideous bbw Well, there it is. I understand feeling bad for someone who didn't realize there was an issue and who didn't get a chance to fix things. Sounds like she had multiple opportunities and has a bad attitude. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451883) |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 9:34 PM Author: adulterous blathering whorehouse you'd better have someone else in there with you or you're going to get lawsuitpwned (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31463462) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:42 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station *Global capitalism gently placing your hand on the gun*
*Raises your arm and points it at young millenial's head*
"Just close your eyes, pull the trigger, and it will be over before you know it," GC whispers in your ear. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:43 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location she is actually older than me. Probably early 40's. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451493) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:45 PM Author: vivacious school cafeteria how can someone that old not know how to practice law (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451511) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:47 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location we have a number of people like this. Been practicing for years and just don't "get it". Aren't able to make decisions for themselves, and when they do make them, they are often terrible....still make big mistakes...don't know what issues are important. I'm convinced that if you don't "get it" after 5 years of practicing law, you will never. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451519) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:18 PM Author: vivacious school cafeteria Please provide an example/anecdote showcasing this (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451774) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:45 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station is she a 1st yr? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451515) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:48 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location no, junior skills, but actually graduated from law school a while ago. No positive why we hired her, but it wasn't my decision. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451526) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:47 PM Author: comical school Early 40s is ting it top genes and takes care of body perfect top, bottom; inside and out! I wouldn't fire her I'd mentor her! "Age is a flamelie (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451523) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:49 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station what language is this? is it like ebonics? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451538) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:56 PM Author: Beta therapy careful (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451593) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:57 PM Author: comical school Ye$ Ebonics my friend! Online Ebonics (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451599) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:03 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station 180 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451646) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:45 PM Author: galvanic self-centered hairy legs range If it makes you feel better,she's prob on wife/mommy track and was just riding things out until firing and won't be upset. Nobody bills 750 if they cared at all about the job. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451509) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:45 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location no kids (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451512) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:49 PM Author: comical school Hmm I couldn't stand people like this at my engineering firm but I ended up covering all of their hours and made a fortune Ljl (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451534) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:06 PM Author: Flesh Violent Windowlicker you're so fucking annoying. shut the hell up already (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451669) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:20 PM Author: Walnut stirring forum messiness cr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451793) |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 8:51 PM Author: cocky copper theater stage lettuce lol'd irl (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31463041) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:54 PM Author: galvanic self-centered hairy legs range Oh hmm, it sounded like she was some 27 year old first year but she's actually a 40s something mid level?
I'm sure she sees the writing on the wall though and won't be surprised at least. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:52 PM Author: garnet fanboi Firing people is never fun, especially when you're not giving them notice (I never give people notice).
It's only slightly enjoyable when the person is a dick and everyone hates the person.
It's never something I look forward to though. People who look forward to that kind of shit are 2 steps away from becoming serial killers. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:54 PM Author: amber histrionic native you mean all AZN's (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451570) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:54 PM Author: comical school Yeah very sick people that enjoy firing someone (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451571) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:56 PM Author: sienna trust fund As someone who just got fired recently (and who has had to fire ppl in the past) my only advice is to be respectful and professional and to make sure she knows immediately that the decision has already been made. This eliminates embarrassing shit like begging for another chance. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451586) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 12:59 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station "This eliminates embarrassing shit like begging for another chance."
jfc. this sounds absolutely brutal. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:01 PM Author: sienna trust fund it's rare but it does happen unfortunately. You just have to close the door firmly right at the beginning. The dude who just canned me said "I need my keys back" first thing so there was no question the decision had been made. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451629) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:03 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station you got fired from the bartender job? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451639) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:07 PM Author: sienna trust fund bar manager bro. I got drunk at the bar on saturday night after a long day shift. I sat down to have a bowl of soup and relax and two regulars bought me a drink. Ended up getting wasted. Next day I came in the owner was there to fire me. No bullshit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451681) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:11 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station wow, that was quick. what now? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451715) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:17 PM Author: sienna trust fund back to pounding the pavement. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451759) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:38 PM Author: trip hissy fit background story whats the big deal? you can't drink at the bar when you're off duty? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451936) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:41 PM Author: sienna trust fund I thought it was a total over-reaction and was not expecting to get fired. I WAS wasted however and they needed to call an uber for me because my phone died. It's hard to explain the vibe of the place but the owner is pretty involved and he told me he didn't think the staff would be comfortable around me after this happened. That being said, I should have had a better read on the situation and not gotten drunk there. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451952) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:44 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station sounds like you lost the respect of staff and thus your authority over them. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451974) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:46 PM Author: sienna trust fund that was his read for sure. Not sure how accurate it is but it's his place and he gets to make up the rules. Sucks getting fired and I know beggars can't be choosers but I didn't really like it there so in a way it's a relief. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451983) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:00 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station your firm gonna keep her on the website and act as a reference at least? it'd be easier firing her knowing she has a good chance of finding something else. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451623) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:19 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location yes, we will. And give her 6 weeks severance. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451777) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:04 PM Author: Mind-boggling reading party azn To be fair, that's what you get for paying your associates shit, no? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451654) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:19 PM Author: vivacious school cafeteria boom (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451781) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:25 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location We don't pay all associates badly, just the shitty ones which we probably should never have hired. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451823) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:29 PM Author: comical school You said there are "many" like her in your firm! Why not clean house? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451854) |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 4:21 PM Author: Low-t temple haha (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31461159) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:48 PM Author: Mind-boggling reading party azn you don't have some sort of semi lock step system based on class year?
How do you decide how much to pay a 40 year old junior/midlevel lawyer?
How much was she actually paid (give or take - no doobs).
We are having a hard time recruiting talent for real estate - but we are still sticking to people who have firm experience and who aren't aimless fuck ups.
It takes a lot to actually lose money on any associate, but 750 hours might do it. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 4:53 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location semi lockstep, although it is very much based on skills, and we hired a few 10th year lawyers with 3rd year transactional experience, and paid them like 3rd years. Neither worked out, so we won't be doing that again.
We decide to pay the person described above (40 yr old with junior skills) based on experience.
We paid her $140k, which is what we'd normally pay a 3rd year.
Yes, we mostly stick to those people...the couple of times we've done differently when we were desperate for anyone we get burned....granted some of these people have great pedigrees, Harvard and Stanford, but jumped around a lot between lit and transactional and random jobs, and clearly there was a reason. |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 7:20 PM Author: Misunderstood Box Office Mother re: the ppl who "jumped around a lot between lit and transactional"
were they mostly ppl who started in transactional then figured they could do lit? i've never really contemplated doing the opposite (lit to transactional). |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:39 PM Author: Multi-colored sable electric furnace station i feel bad for her but would feel worse if she was some eager 20-something just struggling with a steep learning curve. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31451940) |
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Date: September 20th, 2016 1:48 PM Author: hideous bbw This. I would have serious trouble firing someone enthusiastic that was struggling. But firing someone who obviously just dgaf is much easier. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31452002) |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 4:11 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location fuck, now I have to give her a bunch of work to do knowing that we have to fire her...feel so guilty. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31461067) |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 4:15 PM Author: sapphire business firm it's a kindness to her that you feel so guilty
allow some anger to seep in; if she were more competent, your gentle soul would be less anguished |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 4:20 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location I am not a very angry person. I have a lot/way too much empathy. It is probably why I'm not more successful. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31461158) |
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Date: September 21st, 2016 4:21 PM Author: sapphire business firm they haven't ruined you yet; stay strong (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31461164) |
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Date: September 26th, 2016 10:10 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location Wow. She quit on her own. How fortuitous! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31499891) |
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Date: September 27th, 2016 10:30 AM Author: effete iridescent macaca Details ? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31504362) |
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Date: September 27th, 2016 9:50 PM Author: Dark concupiscible location just found out that she got a job in biglaw with a really good firm. Ho lee fuk, they are going to be in for a rude awakening unless they are hiring her as a junior associate. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31509072) |
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Date: September 27th, 2016 10:35 AM Author: Demanding Soul-stirring Nursing Home Toaster She read this thread. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3357834&forum_id=2#31504379) |