What percentage of these "coins" will have any value in 5 years?
| territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | brilliant space messiness | 01/04/18 | | misanthropic ratface office | 01/04/18 | | Laughsome meetinghouse | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Laughsome meetinghouse | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Laughsome meetinghouse | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Laughsome meetinghouse | 01/04/18 | | wonderful amethyst halford | 01/04/18 | | violet locale marketing idea | 01/04/18 | | Laughsome meetinghouse | 01/04/18 | | Laughsome meetinghouse | 01/04/18 | | Learning Disabled Hell | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | cheese-eating dun institution affirmative action | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | Poppy Quadroon Knife | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | violet locale marketing idea | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | Pungent Gas Station Patrolman | 01/04/18 | | wild factory reset button stead | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Bateful sweet tailpipe alpha | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | flesh partner piazza | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | flesh partner piazza | 01/04/18 | | Poppy Quadroon Knife | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | cheese-eating dun institution affirmative action | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | cheese-eating dun institution affirmative action | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | cheese-eating dun institution affirmative action | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | cheese-eating dun institution affirmative action | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Concupiscible stage | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Magical old irish cottage dingle berry | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Shimmering spectacular lodge | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | violet locale marketing idea | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | ruddy crackhouse goal in life | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | Bearded dopamine | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | Poppy Quadroon Knife | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | ruddy crackhouse goal in life | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | ruddy crackhouse goal in life | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | Jet-lagged volcanic crater | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | cyan circlehead | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | cyan circlehead | 01/04/18 | | heady cordovan step-uncle's house pervert | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | misanthropic ratface office | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | hideous bawdyhouse roommate | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | Primrose seedy giraffe | 01/04/18 | | bespoke alcoholic love of her life | 01/04/18 | | electric macaca shrine | 01/04/18 | | misanthropic ratface office | 01/04/18 | | electric macaca shrine | 01/04/18 | | misanthropic ratface office | 01/04/18 | | electric macaca shrine | 01/04/18 | | misanthropic ratface office | 01/04/18 | | electric macaca shrine | 01/04/18 | | amber sound barrier senate | 01/04/18 | | territorial autistic depressive mexican | 01/04/18 | | Curious drab gaming laptop | 01/04/18 | | amber sound barrier senate | 01/04/18 | | Unhinged abusive dilemma | 01/04/18 | | Unhinged abusive dilemma | 01/04/18 | | high-end boyish chapel karate | 01/11/23 |
Poast new message in this thread
Date: January 4th, 2018 12:00 PM Author: territorial autistic depressive mexican
Right now they are all useless except BTC. People literally only buy them because they may go up in value for some unknown reason. They only have value because people are gambling they may have real value in the future. Seems very doubtful. The technology may end up important but the "coins" don't need to have value for that.
This shit better not fuck our economy.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079324) |
Date: January 4th, 2018 12:02 PM Author: Learning Disabled Hell
"Right now they are all useless except BTC."
Says the clueless OP who knows nothing about crypto.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079336) |
Date: January 4th, 2018 12:23 PM Author: cheese-eating dun institution affirmative action
I'll let you in on a secret: the familiarity and confidence in the platform is a large part of what drives "value".
If its a coin on Coinbase, it will hold value simply because Coinbase is the platform that's putting the coin out there for most people.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079505)
|
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 12:39 PM Author: Shimmering spectacular lodge
"I think the extent and quality of the tech overall wont be the deciding factor on what will dominate the market."
lol, go back to lawyering.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079624) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 12:37 PM Author: Shimmering spectacular lodge
Yeah I'm not betting on people making arguments "we're optimistic that..."
ADA for example has presented its product and blockchain innovations at multiple conferences, has had it peer reviewed by scientists and technologists who agree on the worthiness of its capabilities, it has plans to be able to integrate with quantum computing when that arrives sooner than people think, it has a democratized voting structure along with decentralized currency to be more flexible in dealing with forks, etc. All this is explained in detail.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079612)
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 12:36 PM Author: ruddy crackhouse goal in life
I don't think this can crash the economy, unless people are somehow taking out huge leveraged positions.
Because crypto has literally no serious integration in financial markets, even if it enirely disappeared tomorrow, I doubt it'd have a measurably effect on the economy.
With that said, it's unclear if any large institutions are actually putting this crap on their books. If they are, and they help fuel/cause an epic crash, then feds should fuck them in the ass.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079598) |
Date: January 4th, 2018 1:12 PM Author: Curious drab gaming laptop
It seems like bitcoin does have some real value as a hedge against truly egregious mismanagement of the US dollar and generally other fiat currencies.
Over the course of the next 50 or so years (roughly my expected lifespan), I'd considered that a pretty tiny, but non zero risk.
I'm not sure that most people have enough of their net worth tied up in USD cash reserves to need to actively spend that much effort really managing that risk.
Probably some ex-athletes and trust-fund kids.
To the degree that your net worth is already tied up in a primary residence, the stock market, or a productive business, you are already somewhat hedged.
At current bitcoin prices, its not even apparent that bitcoin is even that well priced a hedge relative to real estate or equities.
Eth has some value as a hedge against bitcoin, and all the others have some value as a hedge against both bitcoin and eth concurrently, though we're rapidly approaching rounding down to zero.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35079812) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:14 PM Author: Curious drab gaming laptop
In any realistic economy, real or virtual, there is a demand for at least one good which is used as a "store of value," that is, not used or intended to be used by the owner, but owned simply to transfer purchasing power across time. Nonetheless, the owner holds this good and participates in the market for it. If many owners standardize on the same good, they affect the market for this good. We can think of their collective purchasing power as a sort of "energy" that flows into this market.
It turns out that the correct collective strategy in this game is for everyone to standardize on the same asset as a store of value, and for this asset to be one of intrinsically limited quantity. If the quantity is not limited, as for example in a manufactured good, a stable pool of savers will not increase its price. If the quantity is limited, as with gold, Bitcoin, etc, the price will increase as savings energy flows in - and, of course, decrease as it flows back out.
There is no way to eradicate this effect from anything like a realistic economy. There is always at least one bubble. Ideally, this bubble is stable, and we call it "money." If you try to spread savings energy across all the goods in the economy, it will stay in storable goods and not in un-storable ones. It will flee from manufactured goods and end up in rare collectibles. Finally, it will flee from a broad spectrum of collectible assets and end up in a single standard. Those who are late in fleeing are, by definition, caught in a bubble which pops - and taste the pain.
You might imagine that investment transactions would neutralize or at least reduce the demand for money. Not so. True, instead of holding cash, you can hold a debt - a promise of cash delivered next year. Your demand for cash, and your impact on the price of cash, is now zero. However, the economy's demand to save cash is unchanged. In exchange for that debt, you gave someone else a bunch of cash. She is now the saver.
Bitcoin is an exceptionally pure test of the BTM, because it has no intrinsic utility. It is uncomfortably reminiscent of that apex specimen of the South Sea Bubble, "a company for carrying out an undertaking of great advantage, but nobody to know what it is." One of the problems with the South Sea Bubble - in fact, one of the reasons why South Sea Company stock could not become a new monetary standard - was the inability to define a reason why one security should be the standard, and not another. There are Bitcoin clones, all more or less worthless. Bitcoin is a protocol standard, and everyone in our era knows how protocol standards play: winner takes all.
When we define the essential characteristic of "moneyness" as overvaluation, not as currency, we see that commerce in Bitcoin has no direct relevance at all to its price. If you are spending in Bitcoin, you are not holding it. All that affects the BTC/USD exchange rate is the order book of the people who hold BTC and are willing to sell it for USD, and vice versa.
Indeed, it is logically possible to imagine an economy in which the medium of saving and the medium of exchange are different assets, and the medium of saving is overvalued but the medium of exchange is not. This actually happens in seriously mismanaged Third World countries, in which all savings flees to gold or hard currency, and the soft currency is held only for immediate commerce. Often with an inflation rate of double digits per month.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080380)
|
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:17 PM Author: Primrose seedy giraffe
they don’t use them...yet.
people use Litecoin.
there’s an online poker site that accepts deposits in over 100 cryptos. sure, you can laugh but they were laughing at Bitcoin too when it started out with similar, humble beginnings.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080409) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:13 PM Author: hideous bawdyhouse roommate
if a business accepts bitcoin as payment today,
how are they determining its value?
is it some exchange value less 5%? something like that?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080374)
|
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:53 PM Author: hideous bawdyhouse roommate
zero.
you are the point of the criticism of bitcoin. it does nothing for you. you don't even know what it is or how it works.
but you made money on it so you think you're smart.
what you are is lucky. you bet on bitcoin going up because
because
and you were right.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080801) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:57 PM Author: hideous bawdyhouse roommate
dude, the technology of bitcoin is not related to bitcoin anymore than the battery technology of a tesla is related to tesla.
people may find great uses for the battery technology used within a tesla and that will help tesla owners not at all.
the problem with this analogy is that tesla owners still have something of value--a working vehicle. bitcoin owners have a unique series of characters they can sell to someone else if they can find someone else who wants the same
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080844)
|
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:13 PM Author: territorial autistic depressive mexican
I'm starting to feel that way.
Posters in here actually thought that the coins represent shares in the company and some even thought they'd be worth something long term even if no one uses them or derives profits from them. The coins would just "sit" in there account and people would buy them just to have them sit in their account.
LJL
Many have confused their earnings the last year from this bubble with their actual skill in predicting these "asset" prices and therefore trust their opinion that they are worth something and will be in the future even if they have no use.
Like " I MADE THOUSANDS ON SHITCOINS AND DID RESEARCH I OBVIOUSLY KNOW WTF IM TALKING ABOUT"
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080373) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:21 PM Author: Curious drab gaming laptop
to be fair, if there's something that actually drives the value of it one way or the other, it's not apparent to me
what news is it moving on?
it does strike me as a large bubble
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080457) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 2:42 PM Author: electric macaca shrine
I know, it's going to be fucking horrible.
I'm planning on trying to import everything into a program like this:
https://bitcoin.tax/
But the problem is certain exchanges don't let you export your trade history, like Liqui. I have an Excel, but it's fucking massive at this point and don't know what to do with it.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080703) |
|
Date: January 4th, 2018 3:00 PM Author: Curious drab gaming laptop
The dollar is already the global monetary standard - what creates any incentive to switch to Bitcoin? If the dollar was financially perfect, there would be no such incentive. The dollar is anything but financially perfect.
Probably the easiest way to see this is to consolidate dollars, Treasury notes, and in fact all securities explicitly or implicitly supported by the US Government - a strong argument could be made that this set now includes both the stock market and the real-estate market - as USG liabilities. To put it crudely, a dollar is a share of stock in America. Like a frequent-flier mile (which is also a liability), it confers no explicit rights, but can be redeemed for valuable privileges (especially on April 15).
This set of liabilities is constantly expanding - quite a bit more rapidly than the Bitcoin pool. In plain English, USG leaks money. It bleeds, in fact, like a stuck pig. When we do accounting in a diluting equity like this, the rational way to track our positions is not by the number of shares, but by the percentage of ownership. If we adopt this "normalized accounting," we see that normalized money is constantly being sucked out of our bank accounts.
Fortunately for those who live in America, normalized accounting also shows us that consumer prices in America are constantly dropping. Price deflation is the rule. Consumer price indexes show negligible price changes in non-normalized accounting, not only because they are fudged and rigged, but because prices are set by dollars competing for goods. Because American spenders have fewer and fewer normalized dollars to spend every year, normalized consumer prices are also dropping.
But the quantity of these normalized dollars is constant, so they have to go somewhere. Where do they go? To Asia and to rich people, generally. If we look at the prices, normalized or not, of the assets that Asians and rich people buy, we see these prices going up. Rather rapidly. So, for these people (who hold quite a few dollars), the dollar is a rather poor store of value.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=3849200&forum_id=2#35080867)
|
|
|