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Everyone who said Iraq had nukes was a lying treasonous retard (link):

why have they not been nuremberg'd yet? Beating the Spook...
disrespectful pearl reading party
  02/23/19
elites must hang from ropes
brass sexy area
  02/23/19
Got to this point and stopped reading: "This when nobod...
rose glittery national
  02/23/19
...
provocative self-absorbed chad
  02/23/19
Speaking of: someone once said that doubting the Iraqi capac...
Scarlet kitchen
  02/23/19
I don't think it's racist, but it is patently false. Kuwai...
Mint anal forum half-breed
  02/23/19
Designed by foreigners
Brindle Church Building
  02/23/19
Tbf, why the fuck didn't Saddam just stop dicking everyone a...
Exhilarant Drunken Station Scourge Upon The Earth
  02/23/19
the "inspectors" were literally foreign spies pass...
Histrionic pearly preventive strike
  02/23/19
afaik this is accurate
coral theater liquid oxygen
  02/23/19
yeah, no saddam was pleading with the west to let them have...
Azure vivacious circlehead library
  02/23/19
lmao we all need to endure an mpa parody from time to time
Hairraiser disgusting brunch toaster
  02/23/19
...
Histrionic pearly preventive strike
  02/23/19
for the most part, saddam didn't do any of that. the US had...
disrespectful pearl reading party
  02/23/19
...
Histrionic pearly preventive strike
  02/23/19
Yeah, but what about destroying existing chemical weapons? H...
Exhilarant Drunken Station Scourge Upon The Earth
  02/23/19
cochran has actually dealt with THAT, too. nobody ACTUALLY ...
disrespectful pearl reading party
  02/23/19
lol knew it was xo greg from the first half of the first sen...
slate swashbuckling parlor cumskin
  02/23/19
this is all cr but Iran MIGHT so we better invade just 2 b s...
brilliant cruel-hearted queen of the night lay
  02/23/19
...
Histrionic pearly preventive strike
  02/23/19
...
Charismatic indigo nursing home
  02/23/19
Media 2003: Iraq is making nukes! Media 2019: There is no ...
provocative self-absorbed chad
  02/23/19
russia
slippery salmon turdskin
  02/23/19
I don't specifically recall a claim that Iraq had nuclear we...
Mint anal forum half-breed
  02/23/19
You don't remember hearing about yellowcake from Niger?
vermilion irradiated box office elastic band
  02/23/19
Sure, but that's pre-enrichment uranium. Claiming a country...
Mint anal forum half-breed
  02/23/19
First sentence of the OP: "Back in 2002, I was sur...
vermilion irradiated box office elastic band
  02/23/19
god, what an annoying series of posts ok, so in other wor...
slippery salmon turdskin
  02/23/19
...
Histrionic pearly preventive strike
  02/23/19
so when bush made statements like "Don't let the 'smoki...
disrespectful pearl reading party
  02/23/19
I like how this guy writes.
boyish effete locus dog poop
  02/23/19


Poast new message in this thread



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:16 AM
Author: disrespectful pearl reading party

why have they not been nuremberg'd yet?

Beating the Spooks

Back in 2002, I was sure that Iraq didn’t have a nuclear program (and said so) , but the nation’s intelligence agencies ( along with the Administration, Congress, the press and the pundits) thought otherwise. I was right.

How did this happen?

I knew that there were, effectively, only four ways to develop fissionable materials: gaseous diffusion, calutrons, centrifuges and breeder reactors ( the plutonium path). All were technically difficult, expensive, and in many cases had signatures that we would have noticed using our ‘national technical means’, such as spy satellites, aerial reconnaissance, etc.

Gaseous diffusion requires enormous facilities, which were not seen. It also requires knowledge of obscure materials properties and huge electricity usage, also not seen. Scratch gaseous diffusion.

The Iraqis had made a gram or so of enriched material back in 1990 with calutrons, surprising because calutrons are incredibly inefficient ( as Lawrence showed in the Manhattan Project). Couldn’t have been resumed with using vast amount of power, which wasn’t happening – we would have noticed. Also pretty difficult under sanctions – you couldn’t buy the parts anymore from competent countries. Scratch calutrons.

Centrifuges are tough engineering, take a big facility ( for the thousands of centrifuges). Without imports ( or money), Iraq would have had to use their native talents. But the Kurds were in revolt, the Shi’ites had recently revolted. Can’t hire them. The country was half illiterate, and had an average IQ in the 80s – and performed accordingly. In other words, Iraq was not Germany. This was apparently unknown to the intelligence agencies. Scratch the centrifuges.

Breeder reactors leak odd noble gas isotopes. Detectable, but not detected. Scratch breeder reactors and plutonium.

Some loon suggested that the Iraqis had perhaps mastered laser isotope separation – when, at the time, nobody else on Earth had managed to do, in spite of vast efforts involving thousands of physicists in the US, France, and the Soviet Union. This when nobody in Iraq ( or anywhere else in the Moslem world) had invented or discovered anything in seven hundred years.

Parenthetically, North Korea managed a nuclear program, without a lot of outside help or money. But A. Koreans are smart, B. North Korea didn’t have ~80% of the country in rebellion, and C. much of their effort was detected by our ‘national technical means’ – they didn’t manage to keep it invisible. That’s hard.

In order to achieve what the Bush Administration alleged, Iraq would have to create an undetectable-by-the-US Manhattan project, with no money, even though they’re not technically skilled, and with most of the population unusable because disloyal ( and poorly educated morons).

Speaking of: someone once said that doubting the Iraqi capacity to pull off a secret invisible, undetectable nuclear program was racist. Indeed.

Money: oil exports were allowed under the Oil-For-Food program, but those monies could only be spent on approved imports. Approved by the US. We would take our time approving pencils.

It was pretty easy to observe & control their oil exports, with only one port (Basra).

Iraq got a little money from kickbacks and truck smuggling. I estimated around a billion a year ( from press reports) . Barely enough to pay for air conditioning the palaces.

So where and how did the intelligence agencies go wrong?

First, they had to please the boss: I didn’t. They told Bush II what he wanted to hear. Second, on technical issues, very few people in intelligence actually know anything. This was demonstrated again later, when the CIA and DIA concluded that we had found ‘mobile biological labs’ in Iraq. Which were actually vans with portable hydrogen generators – hydrogen for balloons intended to measure high-altitude winds, for increasing the accuracy of artillery. Pinheads.

I’ve heard that the CIA had one guy that knew enough to do the capacity analysis I’ve outlined, and he was working on something else.

There were guys at DOE that knew everything there is to know about the nuclear production cycle, including centrifuges – but they were ignored. The CIA found its own ‘expert’ – a mechanical engineer that had worked on the stable platform for a centrifuge project at Oak Ridge – not the centrifuges themselves. Laid off, he became the CIA’s centrifuge oracle, even though he knew little about the subject.

On technical issues, what do Administration political appointees, Congress, the press, and the pundits know? Nothing. Don’t know much about biology, don’t know much about history. They certainly don’t know jack about the nuclear production cycle.

But maybe the CIA is good at humint? No: arguably worse than any other intelligence agency in history.

Have things gotten any better? No.

https://westhunt.wordpress.com/2019/02/20/beating-the-spooks/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830130)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:20 AM
Author: brass sexy area

elites must hang from ropes

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830134)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:21 AM
Author: rose glittery national

Got to this point and stopped reading: "This when nobody in Iraq ( or anywhere else in the Moslem world) had invented or discovered anything in seven hundred years."

This is extremely racist and not ok. Whatever point he was trying to make is lost.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830135)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 9:44 AM
Author: provocative self-absorbed chad



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830420)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:18 AM
Author: Scarlet kitchen

Speaking of: someone once said that doubting the Iraqi capacity to pull off a secret invisible, undetectable nuclear program was racist. Indeed.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830498)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:27 AM
Author: Mint anal forum half-breed

I don't think it's racist, but it is patently false. Kuwaitis have the best desal tech in the world.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830542)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 12:13 PM
Author: Brindle Church Building

Designed by foreigners

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830907)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:25 AM
Author: Exhilarant Drunken Station Scourge Upon The Earth

Tbf, why the fuck didn't Saddam just stop dicking everyone around with inspections? I know this doesn't justify the claims of certainty from the warmongers, but I really believed that failure to comply with inspectors was sufficient reason to attack.

Here's the deal: the 1991 war hadn't ended. There was a cease fire with many conditions, and Saddam broke them. So, ding-ding, begin Round 2.

That said, we did it wrong

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830139)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:45 AM
Author: Histrionic pearly preventive strike

the "inspectors" were literally foreign spies passing military intelligence back to their home countries. he was right to kick them out

before mpa makes another snarky parody thread accusing me of nuttery, here's a link

https://www.theguardian.com/world/1999/mar/03/iraq.julianborger

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830156)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:13 AM
Author: coral theater liquid oxygen

afaik this is accurate

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830486)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:21 AM
Author: Azure vivacious circlehead library

yeah, no

saddam was pleading with the west to let them have honest inspectors throughout. if they only would have worked with him

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830519)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 12:16 PM
Author: Hairraiser disgusting brunch toaster

lmao we all need to endure an mpa parody from time to time

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830917)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 12:54 PM
Author: Histrionic pearly preventive strike



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37831083)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:54 AM
Author: disrespectful pearl reading party

for the most part, saddam didn't do any of that. the US had more than enough intelligence to ascertain that iraq had no viable "WMD" programs. that's why there had to be such a dishonest and sustained propaganda campaign claiming iraq had nukes, that iraq did 9/11, etc. and that's why i'd regard the people who pushed those LIES as traitors, in the judicial sense of treason. they lied in order to weaken the US by wasting trillions on a bullshit war.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830171)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 8:11 AM
Author: Histrionic pearly preventive strike



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830183)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 9:18 AM
Author: Exhilarant Drunken Station Scourge Upon The Earth

Yeah, but what about destroying existing chemical weapons? He used them against Iran, and then claimed to disposed of the surplus. I don't know about you, but it sounds sketchy as fuck to me

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830358)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 4:03 PM
Author: disrespectful pearl reading party

cochran has actually dealt with THAT, too. nobody ACTUALLY cared about chemical weapons because they are extremely short-range when deployed, chemical weapons degrade over time, etc.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37831822)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 7:30 AM
Author: slate swashbuckling parlor cumskin

lol knew it was xo greg from the first half of the first sentence

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830144)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 8:13 AM
Author: brilliant cruel-hearted queen of the night lay

this is all cr but Iran MIGHT so we better invade just 2 b sure

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830185)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 8:16 AM
Author: Histrionic pearly preventive strike



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830189)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:19 AM
Author: Charismatic indigo nursing home



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830506)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 9:46 AM
Author: provocative self-absorbed chad

Media 2003: Iraq is making nukes! Media 2019: There is no immigration crisis!

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830428)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:22 AM
Author: slippery salmon turdskin

russia

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830521)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:38 AM
Author: Mint anal forum half-breed

I don't specifically recall a claim that Iraq had nuclear weapons. I thought the intelligence was no more specific than "weapons of mass destruction" (WMD)?

In retrospect, I think GWB specifically chose "WMD" because it's a term that sounds scary but is pretty banal. Under the federal statutory definition, WMD includes any bombs, any grenades, any rockets, any missiles with an incendiary charge of more than a quarter ounce (which includes most "plain rockets" in the U.S. arsenal, like GMLRS rockets, which "only" have a 250# charge), etc. See 18 U.S.C. §§ 2332a(c)(2), 921(a)(4). It, of course, also includes any chemical, biological, or radioactive weapons.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830571)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:40 AM
Author: vermilion irradiated box office elastic band

You don't remember hearing about yellowcake from Niger?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830575)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 10:45 AM
Author: Mint anal forum half-breed

Sure, but that's pre-enrichment uranium. Claiming a country has yellowcake isn't the same as claiming they have nukes - at best, it's a claim that they're trying to develop them.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830593)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 11:21 AM
Author: vermilion irradiated box office elastic band

First sentence of the OP:

"Back in 2002, I was sure that Iraq didn’t have a nuclear program (and said so) , but the nation’s intelligence agencies ( along with the Administration, Congress, the press and the pundits) thought otherwise."

No one claimed Iraq already had nukes.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830695)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 11:22 AM
Author: slippery salmon turdskin

god, what an annoying series of posts

ok, so in other words, they dissembled and used 'WMD' because people assumed it meant nuclear weapons or something similarly horrific

great point, jack ass

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37830698)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 12:56 PM
Author: Histrionic pearly preventive strike



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37831090)



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Date: February 23rd, 2019 4:04 PM
Author: disrespectful pearl reading party

so when bush made statements like "Don't let the 'smoking gun' come in the form of a mushroom cloud," he was referring to some kind of non-nuclear mushroom cloud?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37831827)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2019 1:26 PM
Author: boyish effete locus dog poop

I like how this guy writes.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4207575&forum_id=2#37831211)