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2023 Law firm financials

Firm Revenue RPL PPP Lawyers Qu...
startling violent library
  01/30/24
Milbank
startling violent library
  01/30/24
AP
startling violent library
  02/06/24
i know nothing about the actual details of either firm, but ...
fishy electric mexican
  02/06/24
Kilpatrick
startling violent library
  02/09/24
Hogan
startling violent library
  02/13/24
$2.74 million per partner? Lmao at these biglaw cucks gettin...
Hateful maniacal hospital love of her life
  02/13/24
he makes more than 99% of biglaw equity partners. shitlaw ki...
frisky nighttime nibblets
  02/14/24
can you do biglaw firm jackson lewis?
frisky nighttime nibblets
  02/13/24
...
Thriller Hunting Ground Messiness
  02/22/24
Jenner
startling violent library
  02/13/24
V&E
startling violent library
  02/13/24
so firms are bringing in record profits but XO is here frett...
Laughsome anal market
  02/13/24
yes bc the partners want to keep making the kind of $ they'v...
frisky nighttime nibblets
  02/14/24
Steptoe
startling violent library
  02/14/24
im amazed they even bother with this crap anymore
ivory excitant degenerate
  02/14/24
Why wouldn’t they?
Swollen Razzle Gay Wizard
  02/14/24
(KTRA Masterman)
mind-boggling space doctorate
  02/14/24
it was pretty stupid in the first place. private companies &...
ivory excitant degenerate
  02/14/24
Yeah Maybe they fear withdrawing would signal trouble at ...
Swollen Razzle Gay Wizard
  02/14/24
Akin
startling violent library
  02/15/24
Faegre
startling violent library
  02/21/24
Seems like Faegre is a TTT in decline
Swashbuckling bat-shit-crazy psychic
  02/21/24
Better when they were just Faegre Benson
nofapping kitchen sound barrier
  02/23/24
Bradley Arant
startling violent library
  02/21/24
Quinn
startling violent library
  02/21/24
$7.25m
Gay Useless Meetinghouse Antidepressant Drug
  02/22/24
Dorsey
startling violent library
  02/22/24
"When there are too many lawyers, there can be no justi...
purple heady spot
  02/22/24
"When there are too many equity partners, there can be ...
Thriller Hunting Ground Messiness
  02/22/24
...
purple heady spot
  02/22/24
McDermott
startling violent library
  02/22/24
...
Mint chapel milk
  02/22/24
Paul Hastings
startling violent library
  02/22/24
Mcguire Woods
startling violent library
  02/23/24
Blank Rome
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Greenberg
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Nelson Mullins
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Jackson Walker
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Holland Hart
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Nixon Peabody
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Haynes and Boone
startling violent library
  03/02/24
Kirkland & Ellis
red supple skinny woman gaping
  03/19/24


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: January 30th, 2024 7:31 AM
Author: startling violent library

Firm Revenue RPL PPP Lawyers

Quinn $2.07b(?) $1.89m(?) $7.25(38.8%) 1,098(8.3%)

Paul Hastings $1.81(8.9%) $1.72(10.5%) $5.4(10.3%) 1,055(-1.4%)

Milbank $1.51b(17.8%) $1.66(9.5%) $5.1(18.6%) 911(7.6%)

McDermott $1.92b(5.8%) $1.43(.3%) $3.76(12.9%) 1,347 (5.5%)

V&E $1b(7.4%) $1.43(2.7%) $3.65(3.6%) 700(4.6%)

Akin $1.37b(11.2%) $1.54(8.5%) $3.15(22.1%) 892(2.6%)

Hogan $2.68b(10.3%) $1.05(7.6%) $2.74(20.3%) 2,561(2.9%)

Greenberg $2.3b(6%) $907k(1.2%) $2.4(3.6%) 2,538(4.7%)

Arnold Porter $1.14b(9.7%) $1.17(5.2%) $1.61(14.8%) 975(4.3%)

Jenner $582m(14%) $1.26(6.9%) $2.3(17.6%) 461(6.6%)

McGuire $1.02(4.4%) $1.1(4.7%) $2.05(5%) 922(-.3%)

Steptoe $493m(13.4%) $1.2(8%) $1.91(16%) ?

Nelson Mullins $792m(8.8%) $857k(3.5%) $1.67m(8.6%) 924(5.2%)

Haynes Boone $592m(16.5%) $987k(8.2%) $1.4(11.4%) 600(7.7%)

Nixon $564m(2.9%) $978k(2.1%) $1.63(1.1%) 576(.8%)

Blank Rome $625m(7.7%) $1.04(4.9%) $1.47(8.7%) 603(2.8%)

Kilpatrick $554m(6%) $972k(3%) $1.51(13%) 570(3.4%)

Faegre $991m(3.8%) $1.04(12.6%) $1.13(14.3%) 957(-7.9%)

Jackson Wal $418m(3.8%) $908k(-4.2%) $1.47(-9.5%) 459(8.4%)

Dorsey $467m(6.7%) $890(4.8%) $979k(4.9%) 525(1.8%)

Holland $358m(11.3%) $811k(7.8%) $882(22%) 441(3.2%)

Bradley $424m(8.3%) $691k(-.7%) $820k(-5%) 614(9%)



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47345636)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 30th, 2024 7:31 AM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Milbank

Milbank, the law firm that spurred the latest associate salary hike, grew its revenue by 17.8% to $1.514 billion in 2023 while its profits per equity partner jumped 18.6% to $5.114 million—a record year for the firm.

Even as its full-time equivalent head count grew about 8% to 912 lawyers, Milbank’s revenue per lawyer was up 9.5% to $1.66 million. With the firm keeping its equity partner ranks mostly flat, its total net income jumped 20% to $846.6 million. Meanwhile, the firm saw 51% growth in its nonequity partner ranks.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47345637)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 6th, 2024 6:57 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: AP

Arnold & Porter Kaye Scholer hit a new firm record last year in its financial performance, growing gross revenue by 9.7% to $1.139 billion in 2023, while its profits per equity partner rose nearly 15% to $1.610 million after falling to $1.403 million in 2022.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/06/arnold-porter-sees-revenue-and-profits-jump-with-pep-rising-15-to-1-6m/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47373603)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 6th, 2024 6:59 PM
Author: fishy electric mexican

i know nothing about the actual details of either firm, but "Arnold & Porter" sounded way more prestigious before it had "Kaye Scholer" added onto it.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47373611)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 9th, 2024 5:34 AM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Kilpatrick

As Kilpatrick Townsend & Stockton grew its relationships with its largest clients, the firm’s gross revenue rose for the 11th straight year in 2023, and its profits per partner shot up by nearly 13%.

Kilpatrick CEO Henry Walker, who has led the firm since 2013, said in an interview that its litigation and mergers & acquisitions practices had strong years, as well as its “powerhouse” intellectual property team. Those practices contributed to a 6% increase in its gross revenue to $554.13 million in 2023, he said.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/08/kilpatrick-getting-deeper-and-broader-with-largest-clients-sees-13-profit-growth/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47383253)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 13th, 2024 8:09 AM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Hogan

Hogan Lovells followed a year of profitability and revenue declines with double-digit gains that set a new record for the firm’s financial performance.

The global firm netted $986 million from revenues of $2.68 billion, which translated into $2.74 million in profits per equity partner. Year-over-year increases to these metrics of 17%, 10.2% and 20.3%, respectively, came after falling in 2022 by 13%, 6.6% and 8.2%.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/13/hogan-lovells-rebounds-in-2023-with-most-profitable-year-in-history-405-136205/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47397168)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 13th, 2024 10:58 AM
Author: Hateful maniacal hospital love of her life

$2.74 million per partner? Lmao at these biglaw cucks getting styled on by the cali shitlaw guru

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47397541)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 12:24 PM
Author: frisky nighttime nibblets

he makes more than 99% of biglaw equity partners. shitlaw king > biglaw.

problem is, 99% of shitlawyers are broke retards.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402048)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 13th, 2024 11:06 AM
Author: frisky nighttime nibblets

can you do biglaw firm jackson lewis?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47397565)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 7:34 AM
Author: Thriller Hunting Ground Messiness



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47426912)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 13th, 2024 6:12 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Jenner

Firm leaders said Tuesday that Jenner surpassed even its own revenue target last year by growing the top line by 14%, up to about $582.1 million, as the firm’s total headcount grew by about 7% more lawyers. Jenner also increased profits per partner by 17.6%, up to $2.3 million, and net income by 13.4%, to around $246.6 million.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/13/jenner-looking-at-stretch-goals-reached-double-digit-revenue-and-profit-growth/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47399517)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 13th, 2024 9:29 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: V&E

Revenue at Vinson & Elkins hit $1.003 billion in 2023, up 7.4% when compared with $934.7 million in 2022, and revenue per lawyer came in at a record $1.43 million, up 2.7% when compared with $1.395 million the prior year. That improvement in RPL came even as the firm’s total head count grew by 4.6 %.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/13/benefiting-from-energy-work-and-strategic-hiring-vinson-elkins-breaks-above-1b-revenue-barrier-in-record-year/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47400352)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 13th, 2024 9:31 PM
Author: Laughsome anal market

so firms are bringing in record profits but XO is here fretting about biglaw layoffs??

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47400367)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 12:39 PM
Author: frisky nighttime nibblets

yes bc the partners want to keep making the kind of $ they've been making. they will cut people and work the existing people harder.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402115)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 11:50 AM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Steptoe

Washington, D.C.-based Steptoe saw double-digit revenue and net income growth, growing its gross revenue by 13.4% to $493 million, while its net income rose about 24% in 2023, according to preliminary financial reporting by The American Lawyer.

Even as the equity tier expanded, profits per equity partner rose about 16% to $1.91 million. And amid lateral growth, Steptoe’s total full-time equivalent head count rose about 4% to about 396 lawyers last year and revenue per lawyer climbed over 8% to $1.2 million.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/14/steptoes-revenue-grew-13-amid-lateral-expansion-and-rising-litigation-demand/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47401882)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 12:29 PM
Author: ivory excitant degenerate

im amazed they even bother with this crap anymore

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402059)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 1:23 PM
Author: Swollen Razzle Gay Wizard

Why wouldn’t they?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402253)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 1:25 PM
Author: mind-boggling space doctorate

(KTRA Masterman)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402258)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 1:27 PM
Author: ivory excitant degenerate

it was pretty stupid in the first place. private companies "announcing" they made 878k per "equity partner" 15 years ago. now, come on.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402269)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 14th, 2024 1:28 PM
Author: Swollen Razzle Gay Wizard

Yeah

Maybe they fear withdrawing would signal trouble at the firm

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47402280)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 15th, 2024 3:00 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Akin

Reaping the rewards of 2022′s investments, Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld posted a record year in 2023, with revenue up by 11.2%, and profits per equity partner improving by 22.1% as the firm benefited from the strategic expansion of key practices in 2022.

https://www.law.com/texaslawyer/2024/02/15/revenue-up-11-2-pep-up-22-1-at-akin-as-aggressive-hiring-pays-off/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47405916)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2024 11:57 AM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Faegre

The firm made up for lost ground in 2022 as 2023 revenue rose by 3.8% to just over $990 million, inching ever closer to Faegre Drinker’s aspirations of $1 billion in revenue following the 2020 combination between Philadelphia based Drinker Biddle & Reath and the Midwest’s Faegre Baker Daniels.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/21/faegre-drinker-rebounds-from-2022-with-double-digit-pep-growth/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47423726)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2024 12:43 PM
Author: Swashbuckling bat-shit-crazy psychic

Seems like Faegre is a TTT in decline

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47424024)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2024 12:50 PM
Author: nofapping kitchen sound barrier

Better when they were just Faegre Benson

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47431145)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2024 2:18 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Bradley Arant

Bradley chairman and managing partner Jonathan Skeeters said in an interview that the firm’s corporate practices had a strong year and helped contribute to gross revenue of $424.77 million — an 8.3% increase from 2022 and a 43% increase from 2019, according to ALM data.

However, profits per equity partner [PEP] decreased by 5% to $820,000 and revenue per lawyer dropped by 0.7% to $691,000. Those metrics dropped as the firm added 12% more equity lawyers to its partnership, rising from 231 to 260 partners.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/21/bradley-arant-sees-revenues-rise-and-pep-fall-amid-12-equity-partner-expansion/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47424506)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 21st, 2024 4:22 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Quinn

Quinn Emanuel Urquhart & Sullivan more than made up for the 13% decline in profits per equity partner (PEP) it experienced in 2022 with a 38.8% increase that raised PEP to $7.25 million in 2023 due to the litigation-only firm’s increased leverage and flurry of high-profile matters.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/21/quinn-emanuels-38-pep-growth-came-from-heightened-leverage-high-profile-cases/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47425081)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 1:53 PM
Author: Gay Useless Meetinghouse Antidepressant Drug

$7.25m

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47427936)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 7:05 AM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Dorsey

Those increases propelled the Minneapolis-founded Am Law 100 firm’s gross revenue to more than $467.4 million and profits per partner to $979,000. Amid nearly a 2% head count increase, the firm’s revenue per lawyer rose about 5% to $890,000.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/21/consistent-demand-and-increased-rates-help-dorsey-edge-closer-to-500m-mark/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47426881)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 7:11 AM
Author: purple heady spot

"When there are too many lawyers, there can be no justice.”

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47426883)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 2:53 PM
Author: Thriller Hunting Ground Messiness

"When there are too many equity partners, there can be no PPP.”

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47428085)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 3:11 PM
Author: purple heady spot



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47428152)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 12:17 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: McDermott

McDermott Will & Emery, with a string of large health care merger and acquisition and litigation matters in 2023, saw its gross revenue climb 5.8% to $1.92 billion and its profits per equity partner shoot up nearly 13%.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/22/mcdermott-sees-13-pep-rise-as-revenue-continues-steady-growth/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47427568)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 1:47 PM
Author: Mint chapel milk



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47427903)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 22nd, 2024 7:10 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Paul Hastings

The firm’s revenue now stands at $1.81 billion, up from $1.67 billion in 2022. Revenue per lawyer was up to $1.7 million, and profits per equity partner surged 10.33% to $5.4 million.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/22/amid-partnership-expansion-paul-hastings-sees-double-digit-boost-in-profits-and-rpl/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47429099)



Reply Favorite

Date: February 23rd, 2024 12:42 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Mcguire Woods

McGuireWoods’ growth remained steady despite depressed demand in 2023, with the firm surpassing the $1 billion mark in gross revenue for the first time. The firm’s gross revenue rose by more than 4% to $1.02 billion last year.

https://www.law.com/nationallawjournal/2024/02/23/steady-year-in-a-turbulent-market-mcguirewoods-surpasses-1b-in-gross-revenue/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47431098)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 8:47 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Blank Rome

The firm’s PEP metric came in at about $1.47 million in 2023, an 8.7% increase from the prior year, outpacing the firm’s gross revenue, which grew by 7.7% to about $625 million. Net income growth surpassed both PEP and revenue, increasing by 10.2% to hit just over $230 million.

https://www.law.com/thelegalintelligencer/2024/02/29/focused-on-long-term-profit-growth-blank-rome-sees-strong-2023/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457309)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 8:48 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Greenberg

The Am Law 100 firm had a 6% revenue boost, surpassing $2.3 billion in 2023. Amid four office openings in 2023, the firm also expanded head count by 4.7% last year, to 2,538 lawyers, and its revenue per lawyer rose 1.2% to $907,000.

https://xoxohth.com/post.php?parent_thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457311)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 8:48 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Nelson Mullins

The Am Law 100 firm’s gross revenue rose by 8.8% in 2023 to $792.05 million, while its net income for equity partners grew by 5.3% to $285.27 million.

Its average profits per equity partner grew by 8.6% to $1.67 million and average compensation to all partners increased by 2.2% to $849,000. Even as the firm’s head count rose by 5.2% to 924 attorneys, revenue per lawyer went up by 3.5% to $857,000.

https://www.law.com/dailyreportonline/2024/02/29/nelson-mullins-litigation-demand-helps-grow-revenues-profits-by-9/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457314)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 8:49 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Jackson Walker

After a string of record years, Jackson Walker posted less spectacular numbers for 2023, improving its revenue by 3.8%, but with substantial lawyer and equity partner head count growth, revenue per lawyer slipped by 4.2% and profits per equity partner dropped by 9.1%, as transactions and real estate work slowed.

https://www.law.com/texaslawyer/2024/02/28/revenue-up-at-jackson-walker-but-profits-per-equity-partner-dip-with-transactional-real-estate-work-down/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457315)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 9:05 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Holland Hart

But as transactional demand remained sluggish for much of the Am Law 100 in 2023, Second Hundred firm Holland & Hart nearly repeated its 2021 numbers. The firm boosted gross revenue by 11.3% last year, increased net income by 18.1%, and bumped PEP by 22% (thanks, in part, to a 3.2% reduction in equity partners).

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/02/28/holland-hart-posts-22-pep-bump-thanks-to-strong-demand-cost-management/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457366)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 9:05 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Nixon Peabody

Nixon Peabody’s 2023 gross revenue figure of $563 million not only represents a 2.9% uptick from 2022 and a firm record. It’s also a pleasant surprise, said CEO and managing partner Stephen Zubiago, who reflected on his perspective around this time last year as he draws up the firm’s 2024 budget.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/03/01/middle-market-ma-litigation-helped-nixon-peabody-break-revenue-record-in-2023/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457368)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 2nd, 2024 9:16 PM
Author: startling violent library
Subject: Haynes and Boone

Revenue at Haynes and Boone was $592.4 million in 2023, up 16.5% when compared with $508.5 million in 2022. With 7.7% more lawyers, revenue per lawyer was $987,000, 8.2% more than $912,000 the prior year.

https://www.law.com/americanlawyer/2024/03/01/with-robust-demand-across-practices-revenue-jumped-16-5-pep-up-11-4-at-haynes-and-boone/

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47457399)



Reply Favorite

Date: March 19th, 2024 12:45 AM
Author: red supple skinny woman gaping
Subject: Kirkland & Ellis

Revenue: $7.2 billion (+10.6%)

PPEP: $7.955 million (+5.8%)

RPL: $2.05 million (+7.5%)

Headcount: 3,514 (+2.9%)

Equity partners: 539 (+6.7%)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5483407&forum_id=2#47506213)