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The hard problem of life is still live
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:25 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib You can't just go from cells, DNA, proteins, homeostasis, organization, growth, and reproduction to "life". Those are the ingredients but there is still a residual something that hasn't been explained. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167941) |
Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:26 PM Author: Mind-boggling umber selfie hissy fit isnt RNA WORLD THEORY basically a scientific account of vitalism (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167942) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:29 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib idk but I'm actually being somewhat serious. if you can't describe scientifically how "abiogenesis" or whatever equivalent event or process caused original life to form, or completely explain structural emergence to the extent of fully explaining how nature's "optimization algorithm" caused the emergence of complex body plans with nervous systems, and navigation, and "thinking" and "seeing" and agency, then you haven't fully explained life. also there is the fact that all of this really does almost look designed or intentional (whether or not it truly is) has kind of been brushed under the rug, only because scientists are afraid it gives fuel to creationists, but it is still a big problem and hint (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167946) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:31 PM Author: Mind-boggling umber selfie hissy fit what is there to "explain" it's not as if you need to come up with a causal account or it didn't happen. It happened and all signs point to an oxymoronic ontology wherein very little is amenable to an "explanation from agency" or other free-will hog wash. At best you get an indeterminant reductionism like QM. You can't actually observe mind so there's no point in attributing causal power to it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167949) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:33 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib yeah thats only a small part of what I just said though. I mentioned agency, and "seeing", but even without that there is a huge gap. how did life emerge? and even once it did, why don't we just get complex swarms of cells and networks that are basically energy gradients? how did we end up with complex creatures with body plans that run around? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167951) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:35 PM Author: Mind-boggling umber selfie hissy fit aren't those just footnotes to the clearly correct paradigm of reductionist materialism, and from there can't you just paint the shape of the answers well enough to resolve any personal concern for the answer? Like sure scientists will come up with smart explanations but we know you can only observe matter and the nature/structure of matter is what will explain it.
idk maybe im missing your point and you moved on from philosophy to some kind of complex biology shit i dont understand |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:37 PM Author: Histrionic hospital what do you mean it hasn't been explained. what part of a living organism do you look at and say, that, that right there, those atoms and molecules aren't doing physics and chemistry (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167960) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:38 PM Author: Mind-boggling umber selfie hissy fit the general question he's posing above about what exactly it is about the laws of physics etc. that lead to animal bodies etc. is interesting (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167964) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:50 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib It's not that they are doing something magic outside physics and chemistry, it's more that even advanced evolutionary accounts seem to be missing something about the specific types of structural complexity that emerge. It usually amounts to them pointing at something complex and saying basically its like natures optimization algorithm via natural selection + information storage and inheritance from DNA over millions and millions of years. Which might high level be mostly correct but you can't deny that something is missing here. For instance if we fully understood the "rules" then we should be able to predict most of the entire space of possible body plans and life structures on earth, maybe even on other planets. But we can't. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167997) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:51 PM Author: Histrionic hospital i confess, i do not know what you're referring to as "something missing" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168002) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:57 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib Evolution clearly isn't searching independently over every molecular configuration of every cell. The dimensionality would be absurd. Development strongly biases what phenotypic variation can occur. We don't yet have a theory of how evolution constructs new levels of developmental organization that subsequently become stable, controllable and evolvable units. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168011) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:51 PM Author: Mind-boggling umber selfie hissy fit if you have access to a harness, you may want to strap this question in there (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168003) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 10:07 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib Yeah I think I'll strap this one in. Could potentially carve out a niche at the frontier of theoretical biology, philosophy of biology, evolutionary theory, complexity theory, and computer/information science. This is where all the good stuff lives. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168021) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 10:08 PM Author: Mind-boggling umber selfie hissy fit highly probable (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168023) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 9:41 PM Author: Genius Bear on the loose in Japan Look up Michael Levin (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50167971) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 10:08 PM Author: Lascivious magical shitlib Yeah I have heard of him. It's not that I haven't read any work at all in theoretical biology. I know the types of things they talk about. But I also know there is still a lot to be explained. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168022) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 10:58 PM Author: Genius Bear on the loose in Japan I'll say. I agree with you, "life" is still almost totally unexplained imo (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168088) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 11:36 PM Author: Abnormal Brunch you can't go from life to life? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168196) |
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Date: October 2nd, 2026 11:41 PM Author: Fucking Fuckface Its nbd. Guys at my high school did it all the time (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5909115&forum_id=2#50168213) |