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Crim appellate bro here. Depressing defs get false confidence from 100p briefs
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Date: August 27th, 2024 5:16 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard after i send the briefs to my client, i sometimes get letters back saying how they're so impressed with my brief and how i did a great job of exposing how their rights were violated and how they're now feeling really good and encouraged about their chances of winning.
very depressing to read this kind of shit, knowing that these criminals facing life sentences are somehow confident that my 100 page shitbrief is going to get them out of jail.
i think this false sense of hope comes from the fact that their overworked PD with 1000 cases probably didnt file a single written document over 3 pages in the 5 years that their case dragged on for, and they somehow think because someone shat out 100 pages of stuff about their case, they've got a miracle worker representing them. |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 5:22 PM Author: low-t alpha corn cake so are you saying appeal is theatre like a sophistry to slowly acclimate the prisoners into their new reality? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015399) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:06 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Never thought of it that way and it’s not intentionally that way, but that could be a secondary effect. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015545) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:11 PM Author: cheese-eating coldplay fan I love men (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015559) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:20 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Any of your clients love little boys? PC 288 etc (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015586) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:31 PM Author: cheese-eating coldplay fan I have had some pretty bad 288 clients. They were all with girls though. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015630) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:57 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard I literally had a gay grandpa 288 case. Thought of XO, of course. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015769) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:20 PM Author: Irate flushed marketing idea (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015589) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:36 PM Author: Spectacular Church Building Blood Rage (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015653) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 7:00 PM Author: nofapping violet temple The entire judicial system is rigged to make you accept the outcome. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015779) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 7:55 PM Author: infuriating racy church ceo Legal interpretation takes place in a field of pain and death. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015923) |
Date: August 27th, 2024 6:14 PM Author: fluffy laughsome senate Why are you sending them drafts of your scholarship?
Do they mark it up in crayon? |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:17 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard I meant final draft. I have no idea why I even wrote draft. I’d never send them a rough draft.
A few have insisted that I send them drafts. Of course I don’t. |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:16 PM Author: chrome public bath "The Chow" mentioned in Tom Wolfe's Bonfire of the Vanities (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015573) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:22 PM Author: trip pocket flask tattoo Let's say the judge made a deal with you: you could suck off your defendants and in exchange the judge would release them and grant them a fresh start in life. You wouldn't have to do anything else, you could do whatever you want and you'd still be paid the same. Would you do it? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015594) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:26 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Absolutely not. If this were biglaw (and I’m former biglaw) and the choice would be to suck off our clients instead of doing the work, I absolutely would take the former. This current gig is chill enough that it’s not worth sucking off criminals. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015607) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:28 PM Author: trip pocket flask tattoo Let's say the judge sweetened the deal even further, in exchange for all your clients being exonerated, you would quickly acquire a reputation as among the finest criminal appellate lawyers in the country, the man with the Midas tongue! In other words, no one will ever know that you were sucking dicks. You wouldn't take it? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015617) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:33 PM Author: Lime Elastic Band Cuck but where will i find the criminals (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015642) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:41 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Still absolutely not. Criminal appellate clients don’t have any money. Even the defendants who have a little money will spend it all on their trial attorney and have nothing left for their appeals. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015686) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 7:27 PM Author: Boyish mother foreskin I feel like you are really undervaluing the cum in this hypothetical, it's a lot of cum (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015861) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 8:27 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard About 5% of my clients have been female. How does this hypo relate to the female clients?
One was a super hot early 20's white girl. Let's see if XO can guess the crime. |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 10:03 AM Author: Irate flushed marketing idea Hope she 'got off' (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017688) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 11:21 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard I was unsuccessful at getting her "off" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017992) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:32 PM Author: cheese-eating coldplay fan lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015639) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:39 PM Author: Spectacular Church Building Blood Rage How exactly did you transition from biglaw to writing appellate criminal defense briefs? Seems like a strange jump (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015672) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:44 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard I clerked and did some appellate work in biglaw as well as as much pro bono criminal and criminal related stuff I could do. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015695) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:38 PM Author: Spectacular Church Building Blood Rage (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015668) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:24 PM Author: violent fragrant hissy fit I should have stuck it out in my solo career and gone for criminal appellate defense clients.. it's so pure a field.. words ... But I wound up writing quasi legal decisions for the government
I gave millions of dollars away to working class claimants |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:36 PM Author: cheese-eating coldplay fan Don’t recall ever showing a client anything Ive written. They never ask though. I just tell them “I’m filing this written document to address this issue and I’ll present my argument in court next time.” They are often pretty impressed after the motion hearing though. I’m assuming it’s because they’re not expecting me to litigate anything (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015656) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:41 PM Author: Motley zippy round eye You’re still working as a lawyer while dealing with cancer? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015679) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:45 PM Author: cheese-eating coldplay fan No, I’m on medical leave. Haven’t figured out when I’ll return to work yet but I’ll be back As soon as I feel like I’ve recovered a bit from the chemotherapy.. hoping to ease into it. We’ll see what unfolds (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015700) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 8:42 AM Author: Arousing Crackhouse Philosopher-king Easing into it = 50 felony cases on day 1 (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017522) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:46 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard With appellate, they don’t even have a right to be present at oral argument. Getting copies of the briefs is the extent of their involvement in the case. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015707) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:47 PM Author: Spectacular Church Building Blood Rage What would you say the success rate is? I get the feeling that defbros are usually fucked since courts are reluctant to overturn a verdict, but I've never really dug into this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015723) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:55 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Depends how you define success, but if you mean a result that results in a meaningful impact on the client’s overall sentence, like 1%. If you mean some sort of useless victory like getting a count thrown out that was already concurrent or getting a resentencing because the judge botched sentencing that will ultimately result in the judge imposing the same original sentence, then maybe I “win” in some way in 10% of my cases. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015764) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 7:26 PM Author: Sexy stirring pervert abode Damn
Do you ever see truly innocent bros get fucked |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 7:38 PM Author: nofapping violet temple lol@ ever getting an innocent client (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015879) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 7:53 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Only client I had I knew 100% was truly innocent was a high school date rape case. On and off BF GF and she was scared she was pregnant and cried rape. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015918) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:38 PM Author: Spectacular Church Building Blood Rage loling at this mental image. I've never done crimbro appellate work, but I met crimbros in lolschool before I worked out all my early shitlib foibles. They're barely literate, they definitely can't read a 100 page brief and evaluate it on the merits. "Well, shit, this guy went to college & shit and says I should get out. And it's a lot of pages!" is where the analysis ends (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015666) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:39 PM Author: cheese-eating coldplay fan (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015671) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:47 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Exactly. Their 90 IQ brain calculates that if someone wrote 100 pages, it must be a work of sheer genius. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015720) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:42 PM Author: Motley zippy round eye How much actual work is it to write one of these briefs? I hate legal writing so putting together any 100 page document sounds like torture (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48015688) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 6:51 PM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard It’s not that bad. First, most aren’t anywhere near 100 pages; average is about 50-60. Maybe 10% are that long.
Also any given issue is only 10-15 pages at most. The length of the brief is mostly a function of how many issues I raise. Most of the time, I’m not raising some scholarly issue of first impression that’s 40 pages.
Writing up 10 discrete issues for one case isn’t any more work than writing up 2 issues for 5 different cases. |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 8:14 PM Author: Grizzly Adventurous Legend wtf are there no page limits? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48016005) |
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Date: August 27th, 2024 8:16 PM Author: Violent Swashbuckling Immigrant Plaza This guy really wanted to brag about his 100 pages of scholarship (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48016013) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 8:25 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard I like to unnecessarily cite famous SCOTUS cases, any time it's marginally relevant, so I feel like a scholar. I cited Marbury earlier this year. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017491) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 8:23 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard There's a 25,500 word limit in crim cases which i think is like 150 pages, but i've never been close to that from my certificates of word count. And even then, you can make a motion to file a large brief.
Other than in death penalty cases where you're supposed to raise every conceivable issue, no crim lawyer is using 150 pages.
That being said, it's not good policy to have word limits in criminal cases. Better to let lawyers raise anything they think might stick rather than force them to make decisions about which dogshit issues to raise, and clerks can spend a little extra time reading bloated criminal briefs it means making sure a criminal defendant gets his day in court.
In civil cases, sure, there absolutely should be strict word limits. |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 8:38 AM Author: Grizzly Adventurous Legend Nah this is retarded. If you can't explain the error in 25 pages there is no error. Attitudes like this are why it takes years to get an appeal resolved. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017510) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 8:59 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard This is a non issue. Most criminal appellate briefs aren’t more than 50-70 pages. Nobody’s writing 200 page briefs except in death penalty cases.
It’s civil lawyers who are mostly guilty of writing bloated briefs: 1) so they can bill the shit out of it and 2) to make paying clients happy for raising every possible issue rather than using discretion to choose the best issues. |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 10:00 AM Author: Spectacular Church Building Blood Rage Sorry if I just missed this, but I'm not understanding the business from your perspective. So you're paid a flat fee per brief? Who is paying you? Most defbros are broke and can't afford scholarship (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017679) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 11:20 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard I'm appointed by the government, and essentially paid hourly. There are very strict billing guidelines and 2-3 levels of review per claim and they nickel and dime bills, and they also generally oversee quality. So you can't just write 150 pages raising 20 frivolous issues in every case. Anyway, there are more than enough cases to take so if I get a weak case where there's not much to raise, I just write a short brief and move on to the next czse. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017987) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 11:23 AM Author: burgundy internet-worthy business firm Your job sounds boring as shit to be honest. Would rather work as a trial attorney if I were doing criminal law (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5584141&forum_id=2#48017997) |
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Date: August 28th, 2024 11:28 AM Author: harsh buck-toothed garrison haunted graveyard Different strokes for different folks. Obviously criminal trial work is way more exciting, but it's stressful and unchill and you have to get dressed up and go to court all the time, and you have to deal directly with annoying clients all the time. You also make shit money.
You're comparing my job to the most exciting area of law - crim trial work. Compare it to all the other paper pushing forms of legal work. I think my gig is still less boring than 99% of legal work. |