Anyone read a lot of Summa Theologica (Aquinas)?
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Poast new message in this thread
Date: December 6th, 2021 12:42 PM Author: Anal Fighting Deer Antler
Seems credited but philo types never talk about it.
Even Catholic types rarely do systematics anymore
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43567529) |
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Date: December 6th, 2021 4:27 PM Author: Nudist parlour
To be fair,
*Surveys the state of the West in 2021*
*Pushes up thick horn-rimmed glasses, drops trou and prepares to accept the mount from fancy ivory wall dildo in plush wood-paneled study*
"Suffice to say, the concept of 'religious belief' doesn't -- unghhhhhhhh -- really, uh, hold much practical importance anymore in our modern world..."
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43569067) |
Date: December 6th, 2021 12:48 PM Author: angry underhanded chapel
Read it in undergrad, and thought it was mindblowing and Aquinas was the smartest dood who ever lived.
Now I can't remember one word of it. Can't remember one idea Aquinas put forth. All I remember was that he seemed really lovey-dovey about certain things, and while his logic was sound it seemed like it was all being deployed post hoc. This is probably a retard take.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43567580) |
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Date: December 6th, 2021 1:10 PM Author: Anal Fighting Deer Antler
the format:
claim, evidence in support
correct counter claim, evidence in support
seems like it would appeal to lolyer types
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43567779) |
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Date: December 6th, 2021 5:08 PM Author: pale location
This is hysterical. Aquinas continues to be highly relevant to virtually all moral philosophy. Let's test this, though -- maybe you've achieved a great moral and metaphysical breakthrough!
Enlighten us: how did the enlightenment refute virtue ethics and neo-scholasticism, rendering Aquinas irrelevant to the discipline? Please engage seriously with the works of Philippa Foot, Judith Jarvis Thompson, Anscombe, and ofc MacIntyre.
Alternatively -- if virtue ethics is too small a task for your intellect -- explain how Aristotelianism has been wholly refuted; you should engage with the work of every notable contemporary Aristotelian philosopher (of which there are dozens, perhaps hundreds).
Until you have an answer here, don't ever fucking post in another philosophy thread.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43569229) |
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Date: December 6th, 2021 5:13 PM Author: Bearded Casino Puppy
My assessment above is accurate.
And your response is an unanswerable mishmash intended to show off and name drop to your boart followers more than anything else. Really all your response does is show the world that you are not capable of telling the difference between theology and philosophy in a written text.
And I think the metanarrative in your bizarre attacks on me both here and elsewhere is sort of summed up here.
http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=4978296&mc=229&forum_id=2#43555819
I wish I had said it more artfully there but it gets my point across.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43569258)
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Date: December 6th, 2021 5:22 PM Author: Bearded Casino Puppy
"Theology is either foundational to moral philosophy, or a highly important subset (depending on whether you would like to give a secular account of morality that doesn't simply reduce to preference expressed through force)"
The above just isn't correct. Sorry. And it's pointless to argue with someone who is going to tell me all morality derives from the Christian God, either in concept or His Divine Authority. It's doubly pointless when arguing with a psychopathic person who doesn't think about morality like the rest of the thinking world.
And again, my assessment is correct.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43569299) |
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Date: June 2nd, 2023 10:33 PM Author: angry underhanded chapel
I wrote this and I've since gone back and taken another run at Aquinas. I now think he's worth bearing in mind because he made it safe for church to science and a big deal to a lot of Catholics today. That was a big deal at the time. He did this by masterfully welding Aristotelian logic to church doctrine. He picked up on Aristotle's theory of the unmoved mover and Aristotle's theory that it was the obligation of all living things to aspire to some vision of "the good." Aquinas was able to frame Artistotle's quest for truth as something God wants us to do as we aspire to be "good."
When this became problematic was when thinkers introduced ideas that reject Aristotelian logic in some way. By the time that started happening Thomas Aquinas had been det for 350 years, and the church was fully LOCKED IN on Aristotle.
One of the things that came from this is the notion of progress. The church lost the battle there. Aristotle and the Greeks in general seem to think time was more or less cyclical and that we would be forever have to learn the same lessons over and over again. Galileo and others introduced the notion that scientific discoveries proceeded in linear order from old to new, and that we would keep progressing in linear trajectory toward a more and more "scientific" world where make new discoveries based on a foundational set of knowledge that gets preserved and taught as canon.
None of this is present in Aquinas as far as I can tell. He's giving the church these tools of logic so that it isn't bothered by cognitive dissonance between what the bible tells us and what our brains tell us about reality. He's not tampering with the church's authority to determine what constitutes "the good." The church's position was that if you were doing science, there had to be a good reason.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#46384902) |
Date: December 6th, 2021 10:02 PM Author: cyan arousing roommate
Man, SP is amazing. Just waltzing in here claiming that a dood whose work, 800 years after the fact, is still being written about by academics and plumed for insight is just so passe. We are way past Christianity now, better to abuse our children in the name of Moloch, right SP?
To answer OP: I like to read him on individual topics that I am thinking about or interested in. So if I am interested in the concept of praying for the dead, or the Proof from Motion, Ill just pull up that part and read it. You get a lot more out of him that way than reading him cover to cover.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43570677) |
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Date: December 6th, 2021 10:27 PM Author: Nudist parlour
To be fair,
"Haha, yeah"
*backs away*
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43570838) |
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Date: December 6th, 2021 10:38 PM Author: Bearded Casino Puppy
If I have ever suggested that I’m not serious in any of this then I didn’t mean to. I’m quite serious.
As for being smug, I dont think I am. I can’t help that Hegemon’s and your take is wrong. Should I act like you are right when you aren’t? Would that gratify you? Is that what you like?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43570902)
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Date: December 6th, 2021 11:33 PM Author: pale location
lol
your failure to engage with a single warrant in this thread while somehow thinking you've delivered a rebuttal is one of the strongest self-indictments I've ever seen.
The religious conservative movement that uses Aquinas as its face pales in comparison to the one I back, in which Schmitt is raised to an equal authority
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43571252)
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Date: December 6th, 2021 11:43 PM Author: Bearded Casino Puppy
Okay. Finally. Something substantive to bite into.
What you and Hegemon don’t understand and most real philosophers (not theologians) do is that Virtue or the right good or whatever is never going to be an ultimate destination, only a direction. It doesn’t exist as a destination. Anywhere. Not in heaven. Not in some Platonic realm.
And even the Direction isn’t set by God either (until there’s evidence that this is so and there isnt.). Instead it’s a complex synthesis of merits, utilitarian group calculations, ad hoc shared agreed consensus, evolved fairness calculus, risk benefit assessments and the like that gives us a good if ragged approximation of agreement, and the direction tunes itself by this ever forging dynamic in like manner as we proceed forward. You might have a wish for more certainty, for the golden ring to be already made up and polished, but nothing Nothing is certain the way we crave.
That’s reality. Math does not and will never exactly represent the universe, right? The universe itself is ragged. You gonna hack off bits of the steps of the Great Pyramid to make it conform to your theory?
And to go further, really the heart of things: it’s dangerous to say there’s a final destination or that it’s directed by God. As well as untrue, at least as the observation shows to date. That’s a great way to get people killed, smash shit up, lose all relational I-thou or whatever you want to call it, dehumanize on the way to this fake mirage of a destination when it’s really just the foam on the water as opposed to a hard marble line. That’s reality. Telos makes Nazis. Telos makes fundamentalists. Telos is a step backwards. It’s an inaccurate map of reality.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43571299) |
Date: December 9th, 2021 8:10 PM Author: Odious Maize Space
Summa Theologica Q. 90 is basically the low-key birth of modern liberalism (or at least the portion of it with an emphasis on equality, as opposed to liberty). I'm not even kidding.
Here's the key quote:
"I answer that, A law, properly speaking, regards first and foremost the order to the common good. Now to order anything to the common good, belongs either to the whole people, or to someone who is the viceregent of the whole people. And therefore the making of a law belongs either to the whole people or to a public personage who has care of the whole people: since in all other matters the directing of anything to the end concerns him to whom the end belongs."
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#43585631) |
Date: December 14th, 2022 3:35 PM Author: Bearded Casino Puppy
This might be helpful to folks on here, for a better understanding of ethics generally.
https://nickbostrom.com/papers/mountethics.pdf
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4980043&forum_id=2#45633508)
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