If you already have guns and want to shoot better, grab these books:

- rifle: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BKRX2WF1/

- pistol: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01I2KCR8C/ and https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07QC9S41W/ and https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KKXUEXU/

I'm using them rn to get better, and they're 180.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45549358)

That's a good pick.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550038)

I have a strange assortment of guns. A snub nose 38, a full size 38 revolver, and a mini 14.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45549689)

In any case, I prefer 9mm because of better magazine capacity, and ammo cheapness/availability. Only use case I like for .45 is use with a can, since the round is already subsonic. If you're insistent on a .45, the Glock is a good pistol for it.

If you're open to a 9mm, look at a Walther PDP or Shadow Systems MR920. Both already come with the slide cut to mount optics. PDP is much cheaper, but there were some solid Black Friday deals on the Shadow Systems. They look like they're all out of stock by now though. Get a Holosun pistol red dot, they're solid.

You're going to want more than a thousand rounds though. To get mediocre, that will be enough; to get anywhere close to good, you need a year of good practice at 100 rounds/week, and daily dryfire. Get the pistol books I listed above.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550095)

My thought with the .45 is just home defense. Would like to minimize the chance I shoot my kids through a wall.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550347)

Proper self defense ammo is going to expand like a mf as soon as it hits soft tissue, and will not over penetrate. (Speer Gold Dot is the prime example of this.) I would get a 9mm in your position.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550433)

Edit:also is it worth going for a heavy duty safe like fire rated? I mainly just need to keep kids away.

Also I know pretty close to nothing about fire arms and I should probably start off with a class or something which is what you recommended last year. I've got over ten guns now and I've only shot one. They're locked in tool boxes in the garage. People keep giving them to me.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45549703)

I would get a cheap one unless you have a lot invested in your collection or you plan to keep adding to it. Then it might be worthwhile. I'd also get a long gun safe instead of a lockbox.

Get those books (pistol ones are in order that you should prioritize them), and get a class from anybody on this list (also in order of quality): http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=4586578&mc=167&forum_id=2#41143621

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550181)

Also what do you do about bugs without a tent?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550262)

Sleeping bag -- Bishop Pass 0 Degree ($315): https://www.rei.com/product/164851/mountain-hardwear-bishop-pass-0-sleeping-bag-mens

Really good value on that sleeping bag, I have one and it's 180.

Bivy sack for your sleeping bag -- $100: https://www.amazon.com/Aqua-Quest-Pharaoh-Bivy-Bag/dp/B08F2XHV5V/

Bug spray and a bivy sack take care of bugs.

How much capacity do you need in the backpack? Is it intended to be a large backcountry ruck, or a smaller day pack?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550403)

Hm 80 litres? Big bag for hiking trips

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550483)

80l (good for carrying game meat or awkward loads between the frame and pack): https://www.mysteryranch.com/terraframe-80-pack

Exo Mountain Pack 6400: https://exomtngear.com/collections/packs/products/k3-6400-pack-system

The Exo isn't as large as the others, but imo it's the nicest. Best rucks anywhere near the price range, imo. Super light, durable, modular. Mystery Ranch is also 180.

80l is pretty damn big. I've been able to do extended field problems for work with about 60l, and had room for the full packing list plus radio, spotting scope, and other equipment. You will be feeling the weight pretty significantly with a full 80l ruck, no matter how light the gear. I recommend doing several short trips where you ruck 6-12 miles in terrain, camp for a few days, ruck around some more, and then go home and evaluate every piece of gear you brought and whether you actually need it. You can do a lot with a little.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550533)

If your area's laws would allow a pistol caliber carbine, that would be your best option for a long gun. If not, get a semiautomatic shotgun like a Beretta 1301.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550796)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551474)

2. Absolutely not. 10 minutes of good dry fire with each daily, and 100 rounds of solid weekly practice with each at the range will get you pretty good in a year though. Half of that and you'll be ok. A quarter of that and you'll be serviceable, but not good. Grab the Adaptive Rifle and Practical Pistol Reloaded books above, and that will start you off very well in developing a practice regimen.

3. Modern pistols jam infrequently, assuming you're not feeding it garbage ammo, but it takes maybe a second to clear a malfunction.

4. No. Revolvers have much worse capacity, and are much less capable of delivering follow up shots or engaging multiple targets.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45550934)

The most important component of it is daily dryfire. If you can spare 20 minutes daily, you'll be pretty good eventually.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551022)

- ADM Core Patrol Rifle ($2k) -- best rifle in its price range on the market, is competitive with $3500 rifles: https://www.admmfg.com/uic-patrol-rifle

- Centurion Arms AMTAC Pistol ($1,800): https://centurionarms.com/firearms/amtac-complete-carbine-pistol/

- Sionics Patrol Pistol ($1,600) -- add the two stage trigger: https://sionicsweaponsystems.com/lawenforcement/patrol-pistol-three/

- BRO-SSP ($1,400) -- get the SBA3 pistol brace: https://blackrainordnance.com/product/bro-ssp-p/

- Seekins Precision SP15 ($900) -- good budget option without going to the trouble of building a rifle: https://blackriflegunco.com/product/seekins-precision-sp15/

Buy one of the following sights for your rifle:

- Eotech EXPS3 ($650): https://www.trex-arms.com/store/eotech-xps3-0/

- Holosun 510C ($300): https://www.amazon.com/Holosun-HS510C-Reflex-Circle-Holographic/dp/B01MT5RJLD

- Vortex Sparc AR ($160): https://www.amazon.com/Vortex-Optics-SPARC-Red-Sight/dp/B07YDSVM8C/

If I were in your position, I'd grab the ADM rifle and the holosun sight.

For pistol, grab a Glock 19, Walther PDP, Sig P320XC, P365, or Shadow Systems MR920.

Assume an hour or 45 minutes for a range day. Dry fire alone would put you at 120 hours, and then an hour long range day every week would add 52 more hours.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551182)

Defensive gun uses happen very fast, and a faster aiming device is an advantage there.

My point in bringing up competition is that we can use competitive success, as well as split times/hit factor to measure whether dots are faster -- and they are.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551304)

Unless you have a CIB this isn't a winner for ya

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551496)

Also, should go without saying but don't replace a pistol with a knife lmao.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551225)

I'm formally invoking Title IX

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551504)

He also was sere and a tacp, not a DA guy. Good reviews though.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45551317)

Mil side: cursory understanding, mainly limited to US capabilities and defensive TTPs against near peer, loitering, and civilian side/improvised munitions.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45556964)

You can, ofc, try thermal and IR camo, but that's only viable when stationary.

Lmk if you're aware of some counter to these that I'm not.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45557444)

DISPERSE into multiple small elements. DISPLACE often.

FIND a concealed site. CONFORM to terrain.

OPERATE at night.

CAMOUFLAGE everything. BLEND with your surroundings.

MINIMIZE movement. MINIMIZE radio calls.

POST air guards.

PLAN to operate under UAS. 🖕😜🖕

INSPECT your signature from the enemy's point of view.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45557694)

For civilians, this stuff is the main basis for counter drone ops. In actuality, main objectives are to avoid scrutiny (i.e. don't get caught on screen doing a hit, lest they track you back to your house -- which happens), and target the drones themselves and the operators. Hit them when grounded, or start redacting operators, and that's a much more significant countermeasure.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45557699)

If you insist on a bullpup, try a Tavor or AUG. Never fired either, though so ymmv.

Better to just get a nice upper if you already have an AR lower with a good trigger.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552220)

Do you already have guns, or are you including that in the bag budget?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552306)

also curious what the bag would look like when cost is irrelevant.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552466)

- Are you planning to use this to get to another place (e.g. get out of NYC to your cabin in Gouverneur, leave Houston for your in-laws' place in the Hill Country, leave California for your 20 acres in Montana, etc.), or are you planning on extensive sustainment from this bag (e.g. leave St. Louis and go live primitively in the Ouachita National forest, leave Denver and go build a cabin in the San Juan National Forest, adopt a road warrior life and live out of your bag while you travel on a truck or bike, etc.)?

- What's the climate for your area? What's the 20y record low in the winter, and what's record high in the summer?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552523)

if you would be so generous as to outfit a bag for the wife as well if it is different, would greatly appreciate the insight. I kinda think I know what I am doing but want to see your take.

lows in winter around 20f. highs in summer 100+.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552549)

This is all intended in the context of you making a significant drive to get to where you're going; I wouldn't normally recommend this many tools for a go-bag, but your greatest risks are probably mechanical, and this is geared towards the possibility that your vehicle breaks and you have to fix it (or survive a short time in the cold before you're able to acquire other wheels and continue), your route is obstructed, or you need to gain entry to someplace for shelter. If you pack tools in your vehicle, forget about packing sockets and such in your bag.

MEDICAL

• Medical kit. You should have tourniquets, hemostatic gauze, and bandages. In your pack, you should have:

- this bleeding kit ($100): https://solatac.com/index.php/product/bleeding-control-kit/

- a tourniquet with the kit, a tourniquet on your person, and a tourniquet for your wife's person ($120): https://www.narescue.com/combat-application-tourniquet-c-a-t.html

- boo boo kit ($20)-- throw some Neosporin, bandaids, gauze, med tape, super glue, moleskin, and Clorox wipes in a large ziploc. This is for minor injuries, the bleed kit is for major ones.

- tangentially, this isn't something for your bag, but here's a comprehensive med kit for your property: https://solatac.com/index.php/product/multi-cas-kit/

FOOD/WATER

• water filtration and hydration systems

- one of these hydration bladders for each person in your party ($36): https://www.amazon.com/Hydration-Reservoir-Military-Replacement-Climbing/dp/B071DQSZB8

- water filter ($30): https://www.amazon.com/Sawyer-Products-SP129-Filtration-Squeezable/dp/B00B1OSU4W/

- take some sort of food for each of you. I recommend 3 meals for each of you. I like mountain house meals -- light, taste good, and all you need is water. (~$60).

SHELTER/WARMTH

- mylar emergency blankets -- pack one for each person ($14): https://www.amazon.com/Emergency-Mylar-Blanket-52-84/dp/B0047D6XA2

- fire kit (~$10) -- get 10 lighters, a bag of cotton balls, a bottle of 90% isopropyl alcohol, and a large ziploc bag. Fill the Ziploc halfway with cotton balls, then dump the rubbing alcohol in. Close the bag and knead it until the cotton balls are thoroughly saturated, and add cotton balls as needed until they are all damp but not soaked. Close the bag. That's your tinder, and it takes only a small piece to get a fire going if you have other fuel. This should be very compact.

- propane burner ($25) -- this is 180 for getting warm fast, as well as boiling water or starting a fire; wrap yourself in one of the mylars and turn on this little butane stove inside your cape. 180 way to avoid hypothermia (shed all wet clothing if wet): https://www.amazon.com/RANDDER-Propane-Portable-Isobutane-Camping/dp/B09LSSX8K8/

- poncho/tarp ($15) -- get a cheap tarp from somewhere like harbor freight in case you have to build a rain shelter

- two sleeping bags ($630): https://www.rei.com/product/164851/mountain-hardwear-bishop-pass-0-sleeping-bag-mens

- bivys for sleeping bags ($200): https://www.amazon.com/Aqua-Quest-Pharaoh-Bivy-Bag/dp/B08F2XHV5V/

- rain gear -- if you don't already have them, everyone should own and pack a lightweight rain jacket

- change of clothes and socks -- no cost here, but you should have a change of clothes and at least one change of socks. Put the clothes in a heavy duty trash bag, and duct tape it closed -- this should waterproof them, as the main purpose of these is to give you the ability to change out of wet or very dirty clothes. Put the socks in ziplock sandwich bags in a place they'll be easy to reach if you're feet get wet and you have to move for a long distance.

TOOLS

• You should, at minimum, have a small tool set in your pack. Because you have a vehicle, it's easier to have a comprehensive set of nice tools you keep in your vehicle, but if you choose to forgo that, at a minimum you should have:

- mini socket set ($20) -- these are low quality, but they're compact, cheap, and better than nothing: https://www.amazon.com/33-Piece-Including-58-Tooth-Magnetic-Screwdriver/dp/B0965LBY2B

- basic adjustable wrench from any hardware store ($10)

- propane torch ($22) -- this torch head will work on the the same fuel as the burner, and is 180 for defrosting (or heating up and breaking) locks, bolts, mirrors, etc. Very handy: https://www.amazon.com/Worthington-336737-WT2301-Trigger-Propane/dp/B004FPZACE/

- headlamp with red lens -- red is far less visible at night ($12): https://www.amazon.com/Ultra-Bright-CREE-LED-Headlamp/dp/B019MK6DX6/

NAVIGATION

- laminated maps of your route and area, or a rand McNally atlas ($55) are a necessity. Assume your GPS will fail: https://www.amazon.com/McNally-Deluxe-Motor-Carriers-Atlas/dp/0528026429/

- Garmin ($250) -- 180 navigational tool for off-road land nav, assuming you can read a topographic map. There are a few different models, this one is one of the more user friendly ones: https://www.amazon.com/Garmin-Rugged-Handheld-Navigator-Renewed/dp/B07Z5G499R/

MISC

- cash -- cash is king if you have to get something fast or buy your way out of a problem. For this, I'd take $2k or so -- enough to buy fuel or food or lodging or medical care in an emergency.

- ammo -- if you're not taking ammo in LBE/plate carrier, you should definitely have some loaded mags in your pack.

- caffeine -- if you're driving more than 2 tanks of gas, straight through, that's probably a 10+ hour drive. Have something packed so you have caffeine ready to go.

- cordage/550 -- get 100' of 550/paracord, it's useful for a lot of things ($10): https://www.amazon.com/PARACORD-PLANET-Paracord-50-Colors/dp/B01LZPGIE9/

- duck tape

This concludes your individual packs, and brings your total to $1,600 without considering the bags.

BAG

• For all of this, I'd go with something like a Mystery Ranch or Exo MTN Pack for you, and a lighter Mystery Ranch pack for your wife. If the kid is a teenager, they should carry their own clothing change and meals; otherwise, they shouldn't be carrying anything to reduce fatigue. Bag options for you include:

- Mystery Ranch Terraframe 80l ($500): https://www.mysteryranch.com/terraframe-80-pack

- Exo MTN Pack K3 6400 ($700) -- get the lid add-on: https://exomtngear.com/collections/packs/products/k3-6400-pack-system

- Kelty Coyote 60l ($140): https://www.amazon.com/Kelty-Coyote-60-105-Internal-Backpack/dp/B082P5Y4BP/

- Teton 3700 60l pack ($90): https://www.amazon.com/TETON-Sports-Ultralight-Internal-Backpack/dp/B006JYHHL6/

Bag options for her include:

- Mystery Ranch Women's Glacier 55l ($375): https://www.mysteryranch.com/glacier-womens-pack

- Mystery Ranch Women's Bridger 55l ($330): https://www.mysteryranch.com/womens-bridger-55-pack

- Kelty Coyote 60l ($140): https://www.amazon.com/Kelty-Coyote-60-105-Internal-Backpack/dp/B082P5Y4BP/

- WoneNice 50l pack ($40): https://www.amazon.com/WoneNice-50L-Waterproof-Hiking-Backpack/dp/B07MNBM44W/

VEHICLE

This is tangential to your question, but if I were bugging out in a vehicle, I'd want that vehicle to have the following:

- spare tire -- you should ofc have a solid spare tire in your vehicle

- fuel cans for vehicle -- if you're bugging out, there may very well be a fuel shortage. Having (full) fuel cans you can throw in your trunk to extend your range can be very useful. I like these: https://www.amazon.com/Gallon-Can-Spill-Proof-Container/dp/B00SLPYJX0/

- bolt cutters ($50) -- not many locks or bolts you can't cut between this and the torch: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07DQQDZPS/

• tools -- ever changed a tire with an impact driver? Takes 5 minutes. Doing it by hand is much longer. Things I'd consider keeping in my truck:

- impact driver from a quality brand (Makita or DeWalt > Milwaukee > rest)

- comprehensive ratchet and socket set

- drill bits for both screws and holes

- chainsaw -- if you're going somewhere rural, especially in the winter, a tree across the road is a realistic possibility. Chainsaws are the easiest fix. If you're going somewhere wooded off-road, chainsaws are an essential mobility tool, second only to a winch. Get a Stihl or Husqvarna, with a midsized bar.

- hammer

- spare container of oil and spare container of coolant (two if you're somewhere like New Mexico or West Texas and it's not winter)

- WD-40 or liquid wrench

- flashlight -- something bright, I like this ($165): https://brightguy.com/product/powertac-huntsman-xlt-extra-long-throw-flashlight/

This is long, and probably not exactly what you were expecting, but if I were moving to a distant, well-equipped rural property from a major metro, this + my arsenal is what I'd take.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552839)

Red lens is really useful for when you have to use light but you'd like to avoid being seen.

I keep a toolset in my vehicle because I've had occasion to use all of those at least once, and it's really a relatively small cost overall (and honestly not very space intensive), especially given potential utility (very high if you end up needing it).

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45552918)

Not hypothetically, the ATF has shown up at people's houses after they ordered some, so I'm pretty wary of them. If you have decent machining tools/capabilities, you can do as well or better than any kit.

And ofc, I am not a lawyer but form 1 is much easier than waiting for a can stamp.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45557036)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45557431)

Drones with thermal feed are the closest you'll get to having the Air Force running ISR support. Drones rigged to deliver munitions (incredibly easy)are the closest most will get to having air support.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5242734&forum_id=2#45557440)